Why is the climate changing. (Page 155)

zeffur
zeffur: "while some submarines in the Arctic have features to help surface through the ice, they still cannot surface through ice that is greater than three meters (nine feet) thick. Submarines that are not ice-strengthened can only surface through ice that is less than one meter (three feet) thick. Submarines must be able to quickly locate leads or thin ice to surface quickly during emergencies, to send messages, or to launch missiles."

src: https://nsidc.org/cryosphere/seaice/environment/human_operations.html
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kittybobo34
kittybobo34: That was my point Zeff,, its all pretty thin these days.
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zeffur
zeffur: Not from what I read on line... Shrinking yeah... thinning? No so much...
"sea ice undergoes seasonal patterns of change – thinning and shrinking during late spring and summer, and thickening and expanding during fall and winter."
src: https://climate.nasa.gov/news/3023/2020-arctic-sea-ice-minimum-at-second-lowest-on-record/
(Edited by zeffur)
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ghostgeek
ghostgeek: It seems that in this brave new world of ours, poor old humans just can't get it right:

To understand the impact of reusable bags on the environment, one has to hold two very different things in mind. One: Plastic bags do not biodegrade and are stuffing the oceans, marine life, and our food supply with plastic bits. Two: Considering all the other environmental impacts besides litter, a cotton tote or a paper bag may be worse for the environment than a plastic one.

In a 2018 life-cycle assessment, Denmark’s ministry of environment and food agreed with previous similar studies, finding that classic plastic shopping bags have the least environmental impact. This assessment does not take marine litter into account—so as far as that gigantic problem is concerned, plastics are almost certainly the worst, since they don’t break down on a timescale meaningful to human or animal life.

But when taking into account other factors, like the impact of manufacturing on climate change, ozone depletion, water use, air pollution, and human toxicity, those classic, plastic shopping bags are actually the most benign of the current common options. ...

Cotton bags must be reused thousands of times before they meet the environmental performance of plastic bags—and, the Denmark researchers write, organic cotton is worse than conventional cotton when it comes to overall environmental impact. According to the report, organic cotton bags have to be reused many more times than conventional cotton bags (20,000 versus 7,000 times), based on the assumption that organic cotton has a 30% lower yield rate on average than conventional cotton, and therefore was assumed to require 30% more resources, like water, to grow the same amount.

Even adjusting for the benefits of organic cotton production—like less fertilizer and pesticide use (and therefore less eutrophication and water contamination caused by growing it)—conventional cotton came out on top. ...

With plastic bag bans soaring in popularity globally (127 countries have adopted plastic bag restrictions, and New York just passed one this week), the question of what will replace plastic bags has become more pressing. We know that single-use anything is a terrible idea, whether it is plastic or not, so replacing plastic bags with paper ones will surely have deleterious side-effects like increasing deforestation. Making a paper bag also requires more energy and water than making a plastic bag, so for other environmental considerations besides litter, paper products may be worse than plastic ones. ...

The simplest advice for individuals seems to be this: Whatever you have in your house now—be it a pile of cotton totes, or a jumble of plastic bags—don’t throw them out. Keep using them until they fall apart. Whatever the material, use it as a garbage bag once you can’t use it for other purposes any more. And whatever you do, try not to buy new ones.

[ https://getpocket.com/explore/item/your-cotton-tote-is-pretty-much-the-worst-replacement-for-a-plastic-bag?utm_source=pocket-newtab-global-en-GB ]
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ghostgeek
ghostgeek: Or, and this is surely what our betters should be promoting, see how fast you can head to the grave. Just don't have yourself buried and certainly don't patronize a crematorium.
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ghostgeek
ghostgeek: Bugger, bugger, bugger, it seems we're buggered whatever we do:

Is it just us, or is it getting hot out there? Research shows our rapidly growing universe keeps heating up.

Nearly a century ago, scientists worked out that our universe is expanding. More recently, researchers discovered this rate of expansion is increasing as time ticks by. As our universe expands, the galaxies, stars, planets, and all they contain move farther and farther apart. This means our universe should be getting colder as it expands.

But that may not be the case after all. A team of international scientists compared the temperature of cosmic gas farther away from Earth (and, therefore, farther back in time) to younger gases nearer to our planet and to the present day.

According to their calculations, in the past 10 billion years, the mean temperature of these gases has increased by more than 10 times, Universe Today reports. Their analysis revealed the cosmic gas spread across our universe can reach temperatures of roughly 4 million degrees Fahrenheit. The scientists published their findings in October 2020 in the Astrophysical Journal.

What's the deal here? Astrophysicist and study author Yi-Kuan Chiang of Ohio State University broke it down in a statement:

“As the universe evolves, gravity pulls dark matter and gas in space together into galaxies and clusters of galaxies. The drag is violent—so violent that more and more gas is shocked and heated up.” ...

So what does all this mean for us? Well, if the universe is getting hotter, that might mean we'll also see an increase in cosmic radiation. That doesn't bode well for us Earthlings.

[ https://getpocket.com/explore/item/the-universe-just-keeps-getting-hotter-that-shouldn-t-be-happening?utm_source=pocket-newtab-global-en-GB ]
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ghostgeek
ghostgeek: Now here's something interesting:

Some 2,100 years ago Israel experienced a drastic rise in its sea level, which caused the loss of important infrastructure and might have contributed to the decline of some cities in the region, a new study by Israeli and international scholars has shown.

The researchers considered a period of some two millennia, starting from the Middle Bronze Age (2,500 BCE) up to the Roman Period until the 3rd century CE.

“We saw that from the Middle Bronze Age to the end of the Iron Age, a span of some 700 years, the sea rose very slowly, maybe half a meter, but between the Hellenistic period and the Roman period, the sea rose 2 or 2.5 meters within 200 years, which is a lot,” said Mediterranean Archaeology Prof. Assaf Yasur-Landau, head of the Recanati Institute of Marine Studies at the University of Haifa and a co-author of the paper published in the academic journal PLOS ONE last week. ...

What’s more, historical and archaeological evidence of deserted or declining coastal cities supports the theory that a rapid rise saw buildings flooded and coastlines disappearing.

“We have seen similar evidence of a decline in Acre and other Hellenistic coastal cities, and we speculate that the inhabitants of the period, seeing entire buildings gradually covered by the water, recognized the rapid rise in sea level, but in many cases failed to adapt to the new conditions successfully,” Dr. Gil Gambash, a historian from the University of Haifa, noted.

According to the experts, the rise was especially dramatic.

“We do not know of such an increase in [recorded] history. It is an increase that is recognized only when talking about the end of the ice age and the great melting of glaciers,” Professor Thomas Levy of the University of California, San Diego said.

[ https://www.jpost.com/archaeology/israel-sea-level-rose-2-m-in-hellenistic-period-could-explain-decline-671173 ]
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ghostgeek
ghostgeek: I wonder if climate change had anything to do with the sea rising?

Compared to the subsequent period of the Roman Empire, the Mediterranean was characterised by a colder phase from around 500 BC to 200 BC.

This corresponds with the beginning of the so-called ‘sub-Atlantic phase’ characterised by a cool climate and rainy winters which was favourable for Greek and Roman civilisations to grow crops.

The cool and humid climate of the sub-Atlantic phase lasted until around 100 BC and covered the entire period of the monarchy in Rome. ...

A distinct warming phase, running from AD 1 to AD 500, then coincided with the Roman Period and covered the whole Roman Empire archaeological period.

[ https://www.thegwpf.com/roman-warm-period-was-2c-warmer-than-today-new-study/ ]

Of course, they had to add the following:

However, the historical warming of the Med during the Roman Empire is linked to intense solar activity, which contrasts with the modern threat of greenhouse gases.

No way can the modern warm period be in any way due to the sun. That would be politically incorrect, wouldn't it?
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zeffur
zeffur: re: "“As the universe evolves, gravity pulls dark matter and gas in space together into galaxies and clusters of galaxies. The drag is violent—so violent that more and more gas is shocked and heated up.”

More speculation being passed off as 'science'---what a crock of crapola--we don't even know if dark matter & dark energy ACTUALLY exist....
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kittybobo34
kittybobo34: I believe dark matter is nothing more than more black holes and neutron stars than we can count. Dark Energy on the other hand, don't buy it at all.
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AretoNyx
AretoNyx: Some say gravity does not really exist but I just see such as explaining ideas what people do not fully understand. Some claim supernatural or life forms not from earth without evidence...among conspiracies that scifi has for entertainment as opinion why things happen.
Even with evidence people still think earth flat and moon fake among other things.

So forth dark matter is just explaining things like black holes and neutron stars as humans define such in what can be shown to exist. Some other stuff is just scifi or myth like. So yec thinks black holes are fake or do they think it is in the bible? Many interpret koran and bibles to say earth is flat too, or how things like evolution exist for old earth creationism. Some will say whatever science they disagree to be fake but never give evidence to claims or just cherry pick. Humans will be like that and some war , censorship, cult like, or extremist violence over beliefs until humans no longer exist it seems based on history.
Though humans treat reality of history with evidence similar to facts of science to what exists it seems as well.

Beliefs are often motivation stronger for humans than reality and facing such. Though some times it helps in creativity with belief the only way to find solutions or resolution perhaps is using such reality in all knowledge. Still in the end people lust for war, greed, power, and such over beliefs more than help each other. Even in changing environment to who gets whatever fresh water to food can vary worldwide ...though nature of it all is like this birth into where ever it is interesting to see what people do and don't whatever responsibility or accountability besides beliefs scientific to faith based in variations.


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zeffur
zeffur: "The Cavendish experiment, performed in 1797–1798 by English scientist Henry Cavendish, was the first experiment to measure the force of gravity between masses in the laboratory and the first to yield accurate values for the gravitational constant."
src: https://www.britannica.com/science/Cavendish-experiment

"Dark matter, as it's found in the Universe, is always diffuse and never dense, and therefore it's only the normal matter that can make black holes, never the dark matter."
src: https://www.forbes.com/sites/startswithabang/2020/09/04/ask-ethan-are-black-holes-made-of-dark-matter/

"In March 2005, physicist George Chapline claimed that quantum mechanics makes it a "near certainty" that black holes do not exist and are instead dark-energy stars. ... In the dark-energy star hypothesis, infalling matter approaching the event horizon decays into successively lighter particles."
src: https://www.forbes.com/sites/startswithabang/2020/09/04/ask-ethan-are-black-holes-made-of-dark-matter/

"Do aliens exist? Most compelling evidence of alien existence:"
src: https://www.history.co.uk/shows/ancient-aliens/articles/do-aliens-exist-most-compelling-evidence-of-alien-existence

"Extraterrestrial evidence: 10 incredible findings about aliens from 2020"
src: https://www.livescience.com/alien-discoveries-2020.html
(Edited by zeffur)
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ghostgeek
ghostgeek: Strange, isn't it, that people out there in the real world are actually generating CO2 for useful purposes instead of trying to get rid of it:

CO2 enrichment in greenhouses allows crops to meet there photosynthesis potential. Enriching the air with CO2 can be done by means of the combustion of natural gas or with liquid CO2. The supply of extra carbon dioxide is an often applied method to increase the yield of greenhouse crops. The amount of carbon dioxide in the outside air is, depending on your location, 350 parts per million. This amount is sufficient for plants to grow, however when placing a lot of plants together in a greenhouse, the carbon dioxide levels drop as all plants are using carbon dioxide for photosynthesis. By adding CO2 (CO2 enrichment), it is possible to increase the photosynthesis potential of the crops, especially on sunny days.

[ https://www.dutchgreenhouses.com/en/technology/co2-enrichment/ ]
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ghostgeek
ghostgeek: And of course, when not enough of the dreaded gas is produced, there are serious problems:

The British Poultry Council warned on Thursday that a “severe lack” of carbon dioxide was threatening meat production in the UK and said one poultry factory had only a day’s supply remaining.

In a briefing note, the BPC said poultry producers would be forced to slow or stop production as a result of the European-wide CO2 shortage. The gas is used by meat producers to stun birds and pigs as part of the slaughter process, and is also used to package fresh meat to extend its shelf life.

[ https://www.ft.com/content/3d7765bc-753d-11e8-b6ad-3823e4384287 ]
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Sir Loin
Sir Loin: Ghost I think plant growth is retarded when co2 drops below 400ppm yet this is the target proposed by climate alarmists
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ghostgeek
ghostgeek: From personal experience I can certainly say that plant growth on my rolling acres looks lush. Weeds seem to pop up overnight and the brambles are like an army on the march.
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ghostgeek
ghostgeek: It would seem that I'm not the only one with more leafcover:

Despite ongoing deforestation, fires, drought-induced die-offs, and insect outbreaks, the world’s tree cover actually increased by 2.24 million square kilometers — an area the size of Texas and Alaska combined — over the past 35 years, finds a paper published in the journal Nature. But the research also confirms large-scale loss of the planet’s most biodiverse ecosystems, especially tropical forests.

Overall, the study found that tree cover loss in the tropics was outweighed by tree cover gain in subtropical, temperate, boreal, and polar regions. Tree cover gain is being driven by agricultural abandonment in parts of Europe, Asia, and North America; warming temperatures that are enabling forests to move poleward; and China’s massive-tree planting program. Tree cover is also increasing globally in montane areas.

[ https://news.mongabay.com/2018/08/earth-has-more-trees-now-than-35-years-ago/ ]
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ghostgeek
ghostgeek: In a new study, published in Nature Reviews Earth & Environment, the researchers report that climate-altering carbon emissions and intensive land use have inadvertently greened half of the Earth’s vegetated lands. And while that sounds like it may be a good thing, this phenomenal rate of greening, together with global warming, sea-level rise, and sea-ice decline, represents highly credible evidence that human industry and activity is dramatically impacting the Earth’s climate, say the study’s first authors, Shilong Piao and Xuhui Wang of Peking University.

Green leaves convert sunlight to sugars while replacing carbon dioxide in the air with water vapor, which cools the Earth’s surface. The reasons for greening vary around the world, but often involve intensive use of land for farming, large-scale planting of trees, a warmer and wetter climate in northern regions, natural reforestation of abandoned lands, and recovery from past disturbances.

And the chief cause of global greening we’re experiencing? It seems to be that rising carbon dioxide emissions are providing more and more fertilizer for plants, the researchers say. As a result, the boom of global greening since the early 1980s may have slowed the rate of global warming, the researchers say, possibly by as much as 0.2 to 0.25 degrees Celsius.

[ https://www.bu.edu/articles/2020/plants-are-slowing-global-warming/ ]
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zeffur
zeffur: Below is a url to a graph of the estimated earth temps for the past 500 million years. As you can see on the far right in blue--we are WAY lower in temp than in previous cycles. The temp of the earth changes naturally for many different reasons & we aren't doomed in the next 1000 years if we don't adhere to the Paris Climate accords--which isn't 'real science' driven--it's pure politics...
pic src: https://www.climate.gov/news-features/climate-qa/whats-hottest-earths-ever-been
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kittybobo34
kittybobo34: What I got out of that chart is that only once has the temps changed so fast as it has recently and that was 440 million years ago and led to a hot house planet. The speed of change is the danger, life will not be able to adjust to it.
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zeffur
zeffur: You might have also noticed the oscillation of temps ~300 to 350 million years ago...
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kittybobo34
kittybobo34: Most of those changes were due to volcanic eruptions, the great dying 250 million years ago was due to all of Siberia going volcanic.. We do not know what triggered those events,, could have been an asteroid strike on the other side of the planet
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zeffur
zeffur: How can you be certain of that ^^ belief??
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laffer80
laffer80: To me the question is less “ Why is the climate changing.” but more “ Why is AND HAS the climate ALWAYS BEEN changing.” Well before man i might add. Don’t worry, i don’t expect a coherent answer. Consider it rhetorical if not instructional.
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ghostgeek
ghostgeek: The universe is, and alway has been, changing so I suppose it would come as something of a surprise if the earth didn't reciprocate.
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