Is psychology a science? (Page 5)

Lanfearinc
Lanfearinc: to all you people here who have stated that philosophy is not a science.. then why is this topic in the science department at wire? Someone needs to go put this topic in the religion department to even it up...
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Tony
Tony: Geoff, what an interesting set of topics. Let this Sagitarian try out a shot group....(heh, heh)

First, dead horse. In Venn diagram terms, the circles of psychology and science overlap. So yes, at least some psychology IS science.
More interestingly, why do arguments between Scientists (ooo, I love capitalizing that word) and theologians boil to such a pissing match? Lemme take a crack at a psychological argument....please bear with me and try to understand my meaning even if I'm not using long forgotten syllogism or syntax...

Humans seek pleasure and avoid pain. Seems reasonable and empirical to me. We are hard wired to enjoy food, sex, etc., we flee when we see tigers and all of that Pavlov stuff. We also avoid death (the ultimate pain?) We really REALLY use our nature and our nurture to avoid dying. If we didn't we wouldn't likely be here.
As thinking beings, humans create explanations and predictions of phenomena. I think we can agree on this one, since we are trying to do just that on this site. We also adopt explanations and predictions that will help us to find pleasure and avoid pain. Religion and Science both provide frameworks for understanding things.
Through social evolution, the most adaptive explanations are the ones most likely to survive. Scientific explanations rise and fall, are popular and unpopular, or are seen as useful or inaccurate as new information is gathered and experiments conducted. Religions likewise rise and fall as their PERCEIVED ability to explain and predict reality compete.
Humans will opt for explanations that provide them with the best PERCEIVED capacity to aid in the quest for pleasure without pain. Since Science fails to provide for afterlife, it isn't as useful as Religion for our desire to avoid the grave. Additionally, since Science's theories are subject to revision, Science seems unstable and less certain than Religion. The "never changing word" seems the reliable choice for one wanting to survive. Religion provides the answers Science cannot, even if those answers can't be verified.
But can you believe in both? I can't. I find it most probable that Religion came about through social evolution to help us cope with death (That's right, an old argument: Evolution created Religion). And since Science as a competing explanation of reality is insufficient to support faith (i.e., belief without proof) it will rarely support Religion.

So why does "every thread dissolve into an argument.."? Because folks get nasty when you try to take away their "escape death" coupons. Science threatens to do that sometimes, or at least people perceive it can due to its changing nature. Science doesn't have the tools to find God ("yet"?), but since Science seems to have the potential to totally contradict Religion then Heaven itself is threatened. Some will use every bit of Sophistry necessary to secure a good nights' sleep, and how dare you threaten their security. Do you really want to go to hell? How un-human.

P.S. @ brit Sophomoric, calling the fellow a sissy. His namecronym is SITS, like the Bhudda, not SIS. Pity...
(Edited by Tony)
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StuckInTheSixties
StuckInTheSixties:

SIS is my feminine alter-ego.

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CoIin
CoIin: anyone who believes in hell needs their chakras cleaned
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Lanfearinc
Lanfearinc: @tony. that is probably the most comfortable opinion i have read on this topic so far.. well done! and im not just saying this because i totally and completely agree with you lol (k, maybe i am)
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dellprinter
dellprinter: Psychology uses scientific methods, statistics and similar analytical processes as any other scientific discipline.

However it’s not like balancing an equation because humans behave unpredictably.
So, psychology has given very good predictions on human behaviour, on cause and effect but no two humans will react the same. If two children are beaten in a similar way, will both become a nutter. On average the statistics might show a range of behaviour, from violent rage to depression to the creation of a genius. Humans unlike atoms or mathematics do not follow the same path each time. You cannot repeat any experiment twice but you can give prediction and averages.

This debate then falls into the nature or nurture conundrum and ultimately a creationist argument lol
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xapim
xapim: science and phycology are like batman and robin. their both kind the same but not really their just things to go figure and well' work together, creation and evelution are like batman and the pinguin............
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StuckInTheSixties
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xapim
xapim: if as correct, a aplle is a apple and a orange is a orange. its dangerous thinking ??? science is phsycology,sphycology is science......science is science and psycology is psycologybut they can coinsist confidently or unconfidently , a apple is a apple is 99.9%. creation of in 7 days all was made or evelution we evolved from a austrilianopolist from a explosion....is either or as if belief is an illusion, belief of evelution or belief of creation or belief of what you think.....
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StuckInTheSixties
StuckInTheSixties:

English isn't your primary language, is it?

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Lanfearinc
Lanfearinc: adam sounds like an escapee from the philosophy room
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Scopinitout1
Scopinitout1: Geeez, all this brouhaha. Of course psychology is a science. It's the science of behavior and mental processes. Psychologists use the scientific method to gather their data just as other scientists do, and they evaluate and report their data the same way other scientists do.
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CoIin
CoIin: See problem of demarcation. How are we supposed to say whether or not psychology is a science if we can't even get clear what "science" is?
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CourtGesture
CourtGesture: did you ever stop and think for a minute, you could be wrong/////

;dance;
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oh_good_laughs
oh_good_laughs: I do not understand how this argument has lived this long. At the end of the day, whatever floats your boat, dude.
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CoIin
CoIin: Aye. I'll have a bloody Mary, Risen. Thanks
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Geoff
Geoff: Meh. I don't care that this lasted this long. But I'd like to, once again, point out that there was a deep vein of sarcasm in my original post.

And I think that psychology tries to be "science" far more than "homoeopathy" for instance.

Which is enough for me.
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CoIin
CoIin: I think we should go out back to decide the issue
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One Bar
One Bar: So...is psychology a science?

Sorry, I just walked in and can't be bothered to read through everything here.
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One Bar
One Bar: Psychiatry is more scientific because its practitioners have been through medical college, they have terrible handwriting and they enjoy Garry Larson cartoons. Can't say much about psychology except that its female practitioners are an easy lay when at uni.

"Psychology...applied to individuals, it can be no more science than something like astrology." (StuckInTheSixties)

Not sure I agree with you on this, Oh Wise One. My current psychiatrist has sussed 'what makes me tick' with notable accuracy. And if psychology on the individual isn't a science (because of the requirement for numerous repeated experiments) then should cosmology be considered a science?
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oh_good_laughs
oh_good_laughs: Sits, you resemble a character in a new book i'm reading, 'The Game of Thrones'. Tyrion Lannister, physically you don't resemble each other, but your personalities seem to mirror each other. Perhaps the author based his character off of you?, *shrugs.

If your into medieval reads. With castles, wolves, Kings, wars, lords, dragons, betrayal, then i suggest it. The reviews are sky-high, and so far it has lived up to the hype.
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Geoff
Geoff: Having recently read all of George RR Martin's saga (except for the latest book, that one came too late to read at the same time, it's waiting for its turn on my current reading list), I'd have to say that SITS isn't much like Tyrion, except in his sense of humour.

But Tyrions character is explained a lot more over the next few books.

When you get to book four, Cersei becomes an almost totally different person when you get to her core personality.

Which, I think, shows that the psychology of fictional characters is certainly not a science.
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Geoff
Geoff: And yes, the books are wonderful, the TV show really did it justice too.
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oh_good_laughs
oh_good_laughs: Yes Geoff, it was sense of humor mainly that i was pointing at, but i am only a third of the way thru the first book. Also, the casual mockery that comes from both i find nearly identical, as if it were like breathing.

I was able to grab the 4-set package for like 20 bucks on Ebay, Walmart i seen carries them too. I'm already reeled into this series, and looking forward to the continuing books. The t.v. series looked pretty cool as well, i intend on watching those after the books.

I was hesitant in reading your post, as i did not know how much you were going to inform me. Fortunately i wasn't blind sided by a grave unveiling of events, and i thank you.
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Karma
Karma: The butler did it.
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