Blatant Mistranslations?! Contextual Dishonesty?! Why did christianity paint Jesus into the Jewish Scriptures? (Page 6)

E s s e n c e: Zanjan
"God's Promise was to believers. Sadly, they broke their end of the bargain numerous times but God has always been faithful. God's people are those who love Him."
NO human has NEVER completely love G-d and follow His commandments from the moment they were born until their death. Jews ARE HUMANS, I will love for you to show me a group that has NEVER act against G-d's commandments.
As well, Jews have NEVER claimed they are the ONLY ONES who have a relationship with G-d, BUT rather that non Jews have an equally and important relationship with G-d as Jews do. As well that EXIST MANY PATHS TO G-D, and that no one has to convert to Judaism or be a Jew in order to discover their path.

"YOU DON'T NEED TO EXPLAIN WHO THE JEWS ARE. EVERYBODY KNOWS."
Zanjan, PLEASE enlighten me IN WHAT EVERYONE KNOWS on WHO ARE THE JEWS.

"The Baha'i Faith isn't a branch of Islam. Perhaps if you had read the scriptures of other religions besides your own, you'd be better informed."
Baha'i religion have Islamic roots, just like Christianity have their roots in Jews and Judaism Baha'i does with Islam.

"We're not jealous/envious of anyone - those aren't spiritual qualities. We're lovers of humanity, regardless of race, ethnicity, gender, nationality or religion."
Well, I can say this much, your teachings DON'T reflect what you write, you have shown PLENTY of ANTISEMITIC RHETORIC, something that you people inherited from Islam.

"Baha'is support other religions and their members because the purpose of the Faith of God is to bring unity to mankind. All of God's Prophets agreed with each other and were unified. If one's religion isn't peaceful, one is better off without it."
So far I HAVEN'T SEEN YOU SUPPORT other religions, but rather you spend your time in destroying other religions to build yourself a podium to establish yourself as the "Queen of KNOW It ALL."

E s s e n c e: Zanjan, I see you erased your antisemitic comment on the worth and value on Jews.

"While Jews survive, their world population has been seriously decimated. Many are secular Jews, which isn't worth much of anything."
Yet, I was lucky enough to see it on time before it was erased, take a note and comment about it.

edmund_carey: Not the most important point under discussion here, but, "Baha'ism" is perfectly correct and current English usage which can be found in any dictionary or encyclopedia - as can "Judaism", "Hinduism", "Buddhism", and "Zoroastrianism", none of which is a political ideology.

Zanjan: Please cross reference different dictionaries/encyclopedias and read the entries. If you see that word "Baha'ism" there, then it's to explain the term some people use. That doesn't make it any more correct than the word "nigger", a contraction of the word "ignorant".

We NEVER refer to our Faith as that so why would anyone else?

I'm not in the habit of referring to any of the religions you mentioned that way - I think it's disrespectful, at the very least, a mark of laziness. Notice there's no Christianism - that should tell you who's doing the word-smiting.

Zanjan: Jaguar, re: >>> zanjan wrote: ""While Jews survive, their world population has been seriously decimated. Many are secular Jews, which isn't worth much of anything."

I didn't erase that comment - it's still in the post. Put it together with what I wrote in successive post:

"“the value of a nation can't be compared to the value of a devoted relationship with God.”

Zanjan: Jaguar: “ This is why I am CONFRONTING your antisemitic agendas and ignorance.”

The faith of God is non-confrontational. God has never asked believers battle against others – He’s commanded the opposite. Do battle your own self, face your own demons, and rise above your own shortcomings. God has exhorted you to practice mindfulness, pour out love on all, and create peace – He hasn’t asked anyone to do anything else except mention His Name.

Those who willingly bow to His bidding are blessed; even so, victory belongs to God.

For what it’s worth, no one can play the race card with me. Hiding behind skin or ethnicity to assume impunity for one’s errors is really immature. Those with wooden spears shake them against the wind.

“I will love for you to show me a group that has NEVER act against G-d's commandments.”

Remember, you said “group”. I’ll be straightforward -> Baha’i’s. Unlike other groups, this religion hasn’t had enough time to become corrupted with human meddling, grow old, die, and rot, leaving only dry bones. Still, as with any other group, a few individuals do leave; and, once out of the door, they’re no longer associated with the reputation of the group.

Zanjan: “Baha'i religion have Islamic roots, just like Christianity have their roots in Jews and Judaism Baha'i does with Islam.”

That a religion agrees with previous religions doesn’t suggest in the slightest its seed germinated there.

Where are the roots of the Jewish Faith? Some will say in the Faith of Abraham; others will say in Noah or Adam.

Our answer is right if we first explain that **the seed** pertains to a royal spiritual lineage of Prophets which runs along the genetic descendants of Abraham. This has been reaffirmed in all the texts since Moses stated it as proof of the Revelator, not proof of faith.

"The roots" of a religion, however, are in the Kingdom of GOD, a vast domain. Where one of these religions initially appears on earth indicates that it’s always amongst the most perverted and debased of peoples at the time.

Your religion arose out of a cesspit; so did mine. The Spiritual Sun always rises in the East, out of the darkness, and travels west across the heavens so no one can miss it. Show me the man who doesn't know day from night!

edmund_carey: Try to resist the temptation to make a fool of yourself by arbitrating English usage, Zanjan. It's embarrassing and affects the credibility of your other opinions. English usage is what it is, it's nobody's place to order it to be something else. "Judaism", Hinduism" "Buddhism" and "Zoroastrianism" are not disrespectful terms. That's why everyone uses them. And that's why they also use "Baha'ism".

E s s e n c e: Zanjan
Remember, you said “group”. I’ll be straightforward"
"God's Promise was to believers. Sadly, THEY BROKE THEIR END OF THE BARGAIN NUMEROUS TIMES but God has always been faithful. God's people are those who love Him."

The reference you made of THEY is the Jews, show me any religious text were your religion accepts the Baha'i people have disobeyed G-d's commandments. As far as I know, not even Muslims accept in their religious text as a group the lack the unity to accept and obey G-d's law.


"The faith of God is non-confrontational. God has never asked believers battle against others – He’s commanded the opposite. Do battle your own self, face your own demons, and rise above your own shortcomings. God has exhorted you to practice mindfulness, pour out love on all, and create peace – He hasn’t asked anyone to do anything else except mention His Name."

You said in another religion forum the Jews DESERVED what happened to them, you have antisemitic rhetoric CONSTANTLY. You use the Jews as a point of reference as what not to do, you CAN'T hold your own stand and ground WITHOUT using the Jews, Judaism and Judaic writings.
YOUR ACTIONS ARE CONFRONTATIONAL. yet, you are trying to tell what believers should do while you are the QUEEN of PASSIVE AGGRESSIVE and AGGRESSIVE ANTISEMITISM, get real, Zanjan.

Zanjan: Edmond: "And that's why they also use "Baha'ism".

They use it because they're totally ignorant. I've just given you the correct information but it appears you refuse to be educated even by Baha'is.

Zanjan: Jaguar: "The reference you made of THEY is the Jews,"

Nope. When I said "THEY", that refers to the sentence's antecedent -> "believers".

God's Promise is directed to anyone who professes belief in Him, joins His Cause, and claims to practice - that's the condition when they become a member of a religion. Essentially, God is promising "If you do this for me, I'll do that for you". I'm beginning to think you don't know this.

God didn't make promises just to one people, such as the Jews - it's all inclusive.

When quoting me or anyone else, reply to that quote - not to another subject from a different post, topic or website.

I can't make out what you're trying to say in your last post - it's disjointed, rambling and incoherent. Please try to focus by returning to your initial post and read your question to me again.

Zanjan: The topic question is: "Why did Christianity paint Jesus into the Jewish scriptures?"

They didn't. They cited what was already in them, specifically, Moses's statement about the Next Promised One. Deuteronomy 18:15

There's no mention of His birth name because prophecy never does that. There's no way to misinterpret this to mean anything other than that Promised One will be a man - not a god but a man. Moses was a man, not a god. He spoke in several voices and in this passage, Moses is speaking in the voice of the Revelator to His people, saying this man will be among the brethren of the followers of Moses.

In reading the passage cited above, we get the sense that Moses is indicating the Jews would know Who He was talking about. HOW? We can gather that this man will help them out by announcing Himself, just like Moses had to announce Himself.

Christianity claims that no other personage fits the description of this man other than Jesus, the Christ. Ergo, Jesus was like Moses, carrying that same rank. Christianity later deviated from this truth when it asserted that Jesus was above that rank.

That has nothing to do with OT scriptures; they don't mention such a thing.

zeffur: re: "Now lets see it in The Tankah: For dogs have surrounded me; a band of evildoers has encompassed me, like a lion, my hands and feet."

That ^^ is a poor translation.

KJV: "For dogs have compassed me: the assembly of the wicked have inclosed me: they pierced my hands and my feet."

That ^^ isn't a great translation either. Most likely what is meant is: "For dogs have compassed me: the assembly of the wicked have [e]nclosed me: [like a lion] they pierced my hands and my feet."

Like a lion would bite a person's hands & feed when they are trying to fight it. It' is apparently figurative language used by David regarding his enemies.

Does that verse have anything to do with Jesus? Unknown, but, if you read the whole chapter, you will see a couple of verses are the same in the New Testament...for example:

"...my God, why hast thou forsaken me?" Psa 22:1

"They part my garments among them, and cast lots upon my vesture." Psa 22:18

zeffur: re: "amoregrowers: Steven full of the spirit had these things to say

...and Joseph sent word and invited Jacob his father and all his relatives to come to him, seventy‑five persons in all.” [Act 7:14]

75??? Or 70???
Remember in Judaism numbers mean something..

“Your fathers went down to Egypt seventy persons in all.” [Deuteronomy 10:22, Exodus 1:5, Genesis 46:27]"

This explanation seems coherent:

"...the discrepancies can be explained by the fact that Stephen was probably quoting from the Septuagint (the Greek version of the OT) which states, “And all the souls from Jacob were seventy-five” (Ex. 1:5), rather than the Hebrew, which states “And all the persons who came from the loins of Jacob were seventy in number, but Joseph was already in Egypt” (Ex. 1:5, nasb). The difference arises from the difference in the way the totals are calculated.

Jacob has twelve sons. Adding Jacob’s grandsons and great-grandsons, the total was 66. Adding Ephraim and Manasseh who were born to Joseph in Egypt, the total is 68. When you add Jacob and his wife the total is 70, as the Hebrew records. The Septuagint, however, starting with Jacob’s 12 sons, added Jacob’s grandsons and great-grandsons for a total of 66. Then, it added the seven additional descendants of Joseph who were probably sons of Ephraim and Manasseh who were born to Joseph’s sons some time after the migration of Jacob to Egypt, but before Jacob died. The Septuagint also omitted Jacob and his wife. This makes a total of 75 as Stephen mentions in the Acts passage. "
src: https://defendinginerrancy.com/bible-solutions/Acts_7.14.php

Zanjan: zeffur wrote: "Does that verse have anything to do with Jesus? Unknown......,"

Wahdyya mean "unknown"? EVERYBODY knows that pioneers get shot in the back, that every leader has their nemesis. When one departs from the status quo, that draws attention and the dogs will circle - this is the test of fitness. It has always been so.

There isn't one Revelator of God Who was accepted in His own land. ALL of them suffered at the hands of the wicked. If one is a holy person, their values will differ greatly from the populace; this one stands for justice. THAT is to be feared.

Zanjan: Hmmm, you've got to wonder about those who just sit around and count.

zeffur: What are you prattling on about in vain again??

What I clearly meant is that it is unknown by me as to whether or not the claims of *some* people are correct about the words of Psalm 22 being applicable to Jesus. David wrote them in his troubled times & he fought the evil of his time--Jesus did not. Jesus allowed himself to be sacrificed for all mankind...

Zanjan: "What I clearly meant is that it is unknown *by me* ..."

Finally, you're speaking for yourself. That you don't know means you've never been a leader or even a contestant.

Certainly that Psalm applies to Jesus because He was a leader. Jesus lived in troubled times, facing a seriously wicked generation. He came to help a people who couldn't help themselves. While David was a leader and hero, no one credits him with transforming souls and recreating the world. No one calls him the Light of the World.

A righteous man is not an island in any age. Though the times can make them fewer in number, there are always still millions of them and they conduct themselves the same. Not one of them is a coward!

Lots of believers have sacrificed themselves; one expects no less of a born leader, especially a king.
If the only worthwhile thing you think Jesus did was sacrificing Himself, you really don't appreciate Him at all.

zeffur: Are you insane? My original comment was directed to amoregrowers--not to you.

You prattle on in ways that are irrelevant & unimportant--as usual.

The only point that I made was to express uncertainty regarding whether or not what David wrote is directly relevant to Jesus or not & the reasons for it.

David & Jesus both suffered at the hand of their enemies, but David died of old age--where as Jesus was sacrificed & resurrected for all mankind who would accept Him for what He truly was & is--which YOU do not accept.

From The Bibile, we never see that Jesus ever experienced anyone biting at his hands & feets like a dog or lion would do when being fought against. Jesus never fought back because He knew what His purpose was & accepted it--hence there seems to be a significant difference from what David wrote about--even though the enemy is the same.

So, yeah--whatever other goofy & false notions that you prattled on about in vain--keep them to your confused self, please & thank you...

Zanjan: "My original comment was directed to amoregrowers--not to you."

Your "original" comment would be the first one you ever posted in this topic. Your post followed mine and didn't have anyone's name in the body. Anyone can respond to anything posted.

The Bible is full of figures of speech. You have no clue how Jesus felt.

"Jesus never fought back because He knew what His purpose was & accepted it"

Knowing and accepting one's purpose is irrelevant here - anyone can do that.

One thing Jesus never did was defend Himself - He didn't have to.

zeffur: No, silly woman.. my original comment included a quote--hence it doesn't matter if it followed your comment--it was obviously directed to whomever I quoted--which was obviously NOT you.

Zanjan: You sound very confused.

zeffur: Then you should stop listening to the voices in your head.
Nothing I've stated is confusing--except to people who are routinely confused...

Zanjan: You're not a voice in my head, believe me!

zeffur: Let's hope not. The voices in your head are likely evil spirits confusing you, if I was to make a bet on the likely source...