Religious Insanity (Page 2)

deuce916: I think if any religious person was in a concentration camp that it pretty much rules out that a god is on your side.

Zanjan: It's a test, silly.

How do we know how strong we are without a measuring stick? Fine to say "This is what I'd do if I were tortured" until you're thrown into that situation. I knew a very intelligent, safety-conscious woman who ran back into her burning house to save a package of razor blades instead of the cat. No, she wasn't religious. The Fire Department says this sort of "snap" is quite common.

In disaster, people always show their true colours, shades they never knew they had. If you didn't know your own weaknesses, how could you target them for improvement?

Zanjan: As for saying that "devoutly religious people often suffered from anxiety, emotional distress, hallucinations, and paranoia".............

Yes, some have blood sugar problems, PTSD, or geriatric disorders like Alzheimer's; some are in bad relationships or coming out of bad relationships; some have been victims of abuse or just lost everything they owned, and so on. Are devoutly religious people not supposed to be human or face issues created by other humans??

Are they sure they know the difference between a hallucination and divine visitation? They're not medical Doctors, not Psychiatrists, obviously not religious, and not the person who saw it. Yet they're the first to admit almost everyone has experienced Deja Vu.

Zanjan: What about Non-religious insanity? Is that any different?

Let me tell you what this world has come to: Today, I took my brother to see a movie. We were looking for the washrooms in the hallway before we went into the theater and found 3 of them:

"Men", "Women" and........."Men & Women". Yep, that's right. Now what do you suppose they're doing in that last one? Sometimes, offering too many choices isn't a good idea.

suchso: There is some truth in that fake article, eg. "those who perceived God as punitive was directly related to their poorer health, while those who viewed God as benevolent did not suffer as many mental problems".

Most people that believe in God see him as ultimately benevolent.
It's only the atheists that imagine God to be basically punitive.

A_Muse_Mint101: lol @ Zanjan's, 'Men & Women' (Unisex) bathrooms titillating your mind with lecherous thoughts. That tickled me; try this spin-- Offering so many choices isn't your reality to create, it's (all/one) God's to decide how this existence plays out; are you questioning the plan as it unfolds? Who are you to question or disagree with how 'the collective unconscious' of humanity evolves (cultures, genders, groups, etc.)? Perhaps, (all/one) God intended this to be, but people like you who use its name to pervert its desired plan, blah blah blah...? How do you know what (all/one) God wants and doesn't want (for anyone) let alone you or others you may encounter?

It's easy to utilize sophistry of theism to reinforce ANY motive one has, period[.] I can counter most of it fairly easily, on the same level; rather than take the time to refute it with care and consideration while remaining intellectually rigorous (for simpler folk, that means being courteous and honest).

Zanjan: I don't think unisex washrooms are in God's Plan. However, great discoveries are part of God's Plan because God intended that men should focus on using their intellect. Using one's body is next to an autosomal act.

My personal favorite is the discovery of the Wine of Araby; I can hardly imagine a world that never had it. Admittedly, there are lots of choices involved with that one but nothing that should raise eyebrows. Of course, the Italians once called it "the bitter invention of satan" but eventually, they got on board when they received approval from the Pope, who realized that within was a lucrative industry that inspired use of the intellect. The Mormons, however, have denounced it.

Yes, I can reduce the number of choices I give others; out of 10, I can choose two options to make available - the effect is far superior to confusion. We call it priorities.

"How do you know what (all/one) God wants and doesn't want (for anyone) let alone you or others you may encounter?"


That's one of the easiest questions anyone has ever asked me. The answer is: Unconditional Love. This is the mightiest power in existence which can only be accessed through "purity of heart, radiance of character, and freedom of spirit."

These are the qualities of those who receive their knowledge from God - knowledge that's NOT derived from human learning.

A_Muse_Mint101: "Let me tell you what this world has come to: ... "Men", "Women" and........."Men & Women". Yep, that's right. Now what do you suppose they're doing in that last one? Sometimes, offering too many choices isn't a good idea." (I think parents are tending to their multiple children, brothers and sisters who are (over)protective of each other can remain vigilant, and/or any other number of reasons for it being none of your business since you're not going in there.)

Rhetorical: Elaborate as to how your censorious backhanded statement aligns with, "Unconditional Love. This is the mightiest power in existence which can only be accessed through "purity of heart, radiance of character, and freedom of spirit."

Because, in the words of Inigo Montoya-- "You killed my father, prepare to die!" No wait, not that one-- "You keep using that word; I do not think it means what you think it means."

Zanjan: In Canada, we've had Family Rooms since the sixties - this is where the mothers can nurse babies or change diapers. We managed to bring up our children just fine with separate men's and women's washrooms. What's new?

How about the decline of civilization? No, I'm not old fashioned - language is the foundation of civilization; the idea was to use it properly to prevent chaos. There were three options the establishment could have chosen for the 3rd washroom, using correct English ->
"Overflow Washroom"..........Men **OR** Women..........Unisex.

But they didn't, so what do they mean? No, I'm not going in there because I expect its full of uncivilized creeps.

" I do not think it means what you think it means."

Exactly.

A_Muse_Mint101: I was referring to "unconditional love", to which you clearly are lacking having stated, "I'm not in there because I expect it's [sic] full of uncivilized creeps." You don't know, you just believe it to be without any due diligence to determine if your preconceived notion is even legitimate.

Zanjan: " I was referring to "unconditional love",

Yes, I know. It's also much like that with all scriptures.

When someone writes, I follow what they've written. When it says "Men AND Women", that's inclusive, meaning 'together'. Modesty dictates that civilized adults don't publicly share their bodily functions in mixed company. Actually, malls where I live aren't bothering with doors anymore - the facilities are just a hallway that branches off to the right and left like two arms, curving around.

Right - do YOU know what that washroom is for?? Please tell us.

Zanjan: If religious people sat down and took a good, honest look at themselves, they'd ask themselves if they were obeying all the laws of their religion all the time, under all conditions. They should be doing this every day - it's called 'accountability'. If their answer is no, then they haven't accessed unconditional love.

They think it's so simple, like the love a mother has for her babe; but, even animals are capable of that because it's a part of the hormonal function combined with instinct. Unconditional love is NOT a feeling or an emotion - it's a form of intelligence that's not possessive.

A_Muse_Mint101: I'm not shocked you don't recognize the error of your ways.

Zanjan: As if you knew me!

A_Muse_Mint101: I have plenty of cold-reading experience, as well as your posts in this thread, to elucidate me as to what kind of person you likely are; 'as if I couldn't know you.'

You're liekly a generally decent person who has some false realizations about some things, and some distorted perceptions from what less-crazy civilized person would posit on here. But you also indicate a subtle bigotry towards people who differ from you as to what "civility", "unconditional love", and other ideas mean or represent.

Zanjan: "Cold-reading"? Is that another grammatical invention of your own or, should we credit it to a lyric in a boy band tune? It's obvious you've imagined who I am yet that, and clarifying yourself, is unhelpful in this topic. Is it possible for you to stay on track?

Tip: You might want to look up the word "bigotry"

Zanjan: While it's true that a lot of people in mental institutions have felt they had a close connection with God, it's also true they were there for other reasons.

Modern professionals treat mental illness differently than 100 years ago; whether or not patients have a connection with God is now irrelevant. Our society doesn't like to institutionalize unless one is criminally insane.

Meanwhile, the most difficult choice religious people have had to make is who is a prophet and which prophet to follow. The least difficult choice is to make that selection when one has never been religious.

The balance hangs on one thing: where our treasure lies is where our heart goes. Any path or act can be called insane if it doesn't comply with the status quo; it's a sign of advancement that man no longer calls it blasphemy.

A_Muse_Mint101: I have satirical faith you'll distort and misunderstand this quote, as well--

"You can be wrong or ignorant. It will happen. Reality does not care about your feelings. -Education does not exist to persecute you.- The misinformed are not an ethnic minority being oppressed.... No, it’s not your opinion. You’re just wrong." - Jef Rouner

Perhaps if you want to discuss things without leveraging your inability to research what is being discussed rationally, I'll oblige you with fact-based criteria; rather than merely allow others the privilege of seeing how ignorance is just cowardice. I'll show some work.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cold_reading is a well understood cognitive ploy for deception and manipulation. You're not very good at it, which is why I picked-up on it so quickly (you may not even be aware of it (not surprising)). I don't trust you know what bigotry is, so here's the definition: intolerance toward those who hold different opinions from oneself. You exhibited subtle signs of this and I called you out on it.

In closing, your understanding of anything to do with professional mental health is questionable, given your lack of citations and obvious distorted opinions*. It is difficult not to arrive at nor resolve your statements being anything but incredible on matters of mental competency and/or sanity. To this end, I am "staying on track" by refuking/rebuting (rebuke+refute) you as a person of merit weighing in on this subject; if not exposing you as a prime example why this article /may not/ be satirical, after all.

TheismIsUntenable: @Zanjan

If the options are yes, no, wait, then they are always fulfilled. There is no possibility of NOT being fulfilled. How convenient.

The wishing well and prayer are identical in this way.

You need to think more on that...

calybonos: The difference between a wishing well and a collection plate is..

If you grab the money out of the well, you won't get your tires slashed in the church parking lot.

Zanjan: From the link: "Cold reading is a set of techniques used by mentalists, psychics, fortune-tellers, mediums and illusionists to imply that the reader knows much more about the person than the reader actually does."

So, can we take it that you think your experience with cold reading - your being manipulative and deceptive - works for everything? Not quite. All humans are born knowing how to do that.

This topic isn't about reading people or fortune tellers; it addresses actions - that is, classic patterns of human behaviour, not personalities. Groups are involved, not individuals. The APA is a group which imagines it has earned the trust of the people.

I think I've made it clear the APA (American Psychological Association) is in no position to define what mental illness is because they're not medical doctors; they aren't doctors of religion or history either. The news article includes no study.

bigotry: "intolerance toward those who hold different opinions from oneself."

The way you applied the word would have God as being a bigot too. Pssst - facts are not opinions.

" I am "staying on track" by refuking/rebuting (rebuke+refute) you as a person of merit weighing in on this subject"

You have the mistaken notion I care about your opinion of me.

Zanjan: Theism: "The wishing well and prayer are identical in this way.............You need to think more on that... "

I didn't say that. I said "Works the same with prayers", referring to desire - that some kind of action is required, not merely an idle thought. There is a self-evident truth that if we want something badly enough, we have to make a sacrifice. A penny is hardly a sacrifice.

Once again, you're confusing the intelligent mind with the means. There are indeed differences in the object of desire and application.

Zanjan: From so simple a truth comes extremes because people don't understand the nature of sacrifice. In Christianity, people took Jesus to say that one has to give up all they have to follow him. They mistakenly thought it was only about money and possessions (riches).

The truth is that what one must give up is what one is attached to - worldly things, including the self, are of no value in the Kingdom of God.

deuce916: The truth is that you don't have to give up anything. In fact, the truth is that it's in your best interests to accumulate as much material possessions as possible. While you're alive & on earth because you won't get a second chance. Your truth is old shit bullshit.

deuce916: Try giving up that computer you're attached to Zanjan. Then we'll see if you live by the words you preach.