Religion: among the many reasons why the South remains poor and ignorant

davesdatahut: Is it any wonder why the southern states, also known as the Bible Belt, remains the poorest and most uneducated area of the US? They hold events like The Response - a mass prayer event at a public university funded by an organization that promotes the very faith-based ignorance that keeps the South down. And the governor or Louisiana, shamefully, is right there with them.
What message does this send to people who are not Christian, heterosexual and religious? The message is: sorry, we don't want you, no matter what you can contribute by way of talent or investment. When will they learn?
Thankfully, there are at least some calling out this type of activity for what it's worth. See here:
http://www.nola.com/politics/index.ssf/2014/12/lsu_students_organize_protest.html

chronology: The South has traditionally been the centre of working class culture in North America, far more so than the Industrial North. This is curious when you consider the Industrial Might of places like Detroit and Pittsburge. Folks in the South have a rich Culture and have had a real and lasting impact on the world. As a kid I remember everyone I knew having Country Music Records and talking about Jim Reeves and Johnny Cash, later there was 'Elvis Presley' Rocking the entire world. A Guy I knew in the Merchant Marine told me about everywhere he went people knew about Elvis, even up the Amazon. Today TV Shows about the South like 'My Name is Earl' and 'True Blood' testify to the enduring interest people have with Southern folks and Culture.

In short you are making more of a value judgment dave than a real statement of fact. 'Dixie' is a fascinating place, a mix of wealthy classy people and down to earth Southern people.

davesdatahut: Chron, none of that is in question. The South has a lot of rich culture. What also is not in question is that the South is the poorest and most uneducated part of the United States, by a good argin. They have high rates of divorce and single-parenthood. At the same time, they flock en masse to these religious gatherings, which do nothing to expand their view of the world, eliminate narrow-mnded thinking or give them the tools to grow economically and embrace the rest of the world. Indeed, the more they promote these sorts of events, the more the rest of country looks at them as ignorant, living in the past, or worse. The South may have lots of classy, down-to-earth people, which begs the question: why do they hold these types of events?

chronology: dave. We cannot all be rich, beautiful and intelligent, it would be boring were it so. Love her or hate her, the South has given the world much in entertainment and writers and actors like Mark Twain, Holly Hunter, Dakota Fanning, Johnny Cash, Elvis Presley and on and on. Most countries would be proud to have the Southern States as part of their country, I really cannot believe you when say most other Americans see them as 'ignorant and backward' that is pretty hurtful.

Just listening to Southern folks talk can be entertaining 'My but you are a cool breeze on a hot day'.

The only complaint I have against the South is they produced the song 'Old Shepp' a country song about a dear old family dog who died. I heard people playing that song so often back in the 60s it got kind of 'too much'.

There was a joint American German programme back in the 1990s involving engaging prominent working class women in an education type group were folks in extreme poverty learned how to break bad habits and develop constructive ones. Not sure how it turned out.

dave. It is worth remembering, in some Northern States where folks live in fancy homes and drive posh automobiles, they have a heroin epidemic ten times worse than anything in Dixie. But if those drug addicts are lying on their backs in nice nice homes it seems few people find that objectionable.

harlett: i have known folks from the South who remain embarrassed and ashamed that they were raised on home grown vegetables fresh eggs home baked goods out in the country..?????

i haven't met anyone who doesn't think from with-in a laid out box..like hell your thinking out side of those boxes lines...

i think folks whether they will ever admit it or not and it makes no difference to me.. if they will... mistake asking the question does a elder presence of being EXIST differently then us... and with putting a personality to the notion OF along with a moral fiber's agenda..

aren't the history books everyone you have ever known or will know been taught from white washed and then some about human behavior.... HISTORY BOOKS

what cultures weren't shy about being cannibals..what cultures who didn't KILL & eat the meat of their sacred animals but did eat their feces and proudly...

what cultures mated folks of either gender to animals in order to honor that "GOD's animal totem.. unashamedly..

davesdatahut: Chron, first off, most Northerners do not live in posh homes. Nor are they rich, beautiful and intelligent. But the North - generally - tends to steer away from large religious rallies funded by groups that advocate ideas promoted by organizations lik the one funding the rally in Louisiana. Indeed, that type of event would get It's not unheard of. But certainly not the norm. At the same time, the North is more economically prosperous and better educated. I suggest there is a connection, which is my point here.
in addition, I didn't say most northerners see southerners as ignorant. What i said is that the more the South embraces these backward-thinking religious holy-hosanna rallies, the more the rest of the country sees the South as backward.
Moving along, you say the only thing you have against the South is the song Old Shepp. Really? The only thing? Any thoughts on slavery, Chron? How bout Jim Crow laws? Or its low education rates? Or its tacit approval of entities like the one backing the LSU prayer rally? No problems with any of that?
Regarding drug problems, that's a whole nother issue. But, for what it's worth, the north has no monopoly on the heroin problem, just as the South as no monopoly on the meth addiction problem.

davesdatahut: Harlett, uhhhh, what are you talking about?

chronology: dave, well well, your's is a God of wrath indeed dave. The put downs you level against Dixie can be levelled against practically every country on Earth, but you leave out the good points, no? how about the achievement of folks in the South, White and African American who resolved their Race problems in a manner any country could be proud of. Compare events in South Africa, Northern Ireland, Palestine, and about a dozen other regions who bombed, gunned down, and terrorised their rivals for decades leaving dead bodies strewn in the streets, and you will see the folks in Dixie are damn fine people who set an example worthy of any people to follow. Try checking the problems of unemployment and social hardships and you will see England, Germany, France, and on a mega scale Russia all had problems from 1980 onwards. Your fellow Americans in the South are people you can be proud of.

Is the South dealing with problems? yes, we all are, but for some reason you hover a magnifying glass over them and say 'hey look at this'. no people in the world can look good under that intense scrutiny.

And dave, don't forget, the vast majority of people in the South live life at the same standard as everyone els in the U.S.

And yes I still remember the 'Old Shepp' country song. As a five year old I was sat on the floor in front of record player crying because 'Old Shepp just died' as the song finished.

calybonos: I'm having trouble following this thread...

Did Old Shepp die because his owners were from the South and were too poor to afford health insurance?

harlett: huh????? datahut.. have u just been ta set up city lately,or set 1 up..

caly..

this thread is a near mirror image of a convo those two had in another forum..yup sure is..

davesdatahut: Chron - a god of wrath? What are you talking about? I didn't mention anything about any god or any wrath - just the connection between big religious rallies sponsored by backward organizations and the region of the country that embraces them.
And the rest of your post also seems to have little to do with the question at hand, unless you are just responding to my question about whether you saw slavery and its aftermath as a grand example of the great South.
So, all that aside, the scrutiny i am applying, whether intense or not, remains. To wit, that the South remains the poorest, least educated area of the USA, while it embraces things like that unseemly rally in Louisiana backed by backward thinkers. I suggest both correlation and causation. That's my point. Not Old Shepp. Not South Africa. And not the wrath of god.

davesdatahut: Harlett, your cryptic posts remain a mystery. What does it mean when you type: have u just been ta set up city lately,or set 1 up?

chronology: dave. Well Bavaria in Germany is a very High Tech place and created companies like BMW and other outstanding German products, it is also a very Catholic place. One of the richest places in the world is Switzerland, they are strict, very strict, Calvanists over there in Bankers Capital of the world. So it would seem poverty and low education standards are not generated by religion.
Poverty in the South can probably be tracked back the aftermath of it's defeat in the Civil War, another factor is probably that folks in the South often had their little farms to keep them going in food and shelter. Without farms they probably would have trotted away to more comfortable surroundings like the tennemant slums in New York, or the ghettos of Boston in the 19th century, but it is doubtful Southern culture would have lasted long in a sea of catholic Irish and Polish immigrants, not to mention Russian Jews who only spoke Yiddish.

No the good folks of Dixie stayed in Dixie, a tough life back then, but at least it was their own way of life.

davesdatahut: Chron, see here this article, reporting that Germany is not a very Catholic place, with religious followers divided between Catholics, Lutherans and other religions. Overall, it reports a waving of religious fervor.
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Religion_in_Germany
And this article reporting that the Swiss lean toward Catholicism, with about 30 percent begin Swiss Reformed, which could be Calvinists, I guess. But they are not in the majority.
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Religion_in_Switzerland
How all this relates to the South in the USA, I'm not sure. What is not refutable is the fact that the most religious part of the country also is the poorest and most uneducated. There are many reasons for poverty. A lack of education is high among them. I put forth the proposition that the South's devotion to religion - especially the kind promoted in the university rally in Louisiana - does not square well with improving their lot in life because it does not embrace secular education or the diverse nature of American society in a way that makes people of all stripes welcome.
Should you want to look around the world for other examples of mass devotion to religion going hand in hand with backward thinking, economic misfortune and second-class status, check a good number of Middle Eastern countries for that.