Prayer Does it work for you? (Page 4)

CoIin: Hmm, ok. And the next point of importance is?

CoIin: Re - other Gods, oops gods

I think the OT is quite clear. These dang Israelites kept worshiping Baal, oops, baal ( ) ; not Internet porn

CoIin: You do all that!!??

CoIin: Phew

They say the shopping's good in Heaven. Some say it's a shopper's paradise

CoIin:

They better have Sin-atra in heaven. Otherwise I shall vacation elsewhere

CoIin: Never heard of any of them

I'm gonna bring earplugs just in case

Coffrey: Okay, doublas, you're all over the place. I don't care about all the other stuff, other gods or whether or not you're a "true" christian.. I want to know what the point of prayer is. If you have to be a good enough christian to have your prayer fulfilled, then he has no divine plan, and I would also say he's not omniscient. But if you prayer and no matter what you prayer about or who you are it won't fulfilled because god has this divine plan,then what's the point of prayer?
It's either one of the other, it can't be both.

doulas4life: @ coffrey
prayer is a way for us to communicate with God, God wants a relationship with us.
Communication is important in that relationship.
please do not conclude there is no divine plan just because sin hinders prayer.
God is holy, that is why sin seperates us from God, and why we need to be saved.
God is apsolutely omniscient and that includes the ability to know the future.
Therefore God knows what we will ask long before we will ask it.
God also knows whether or not we will choose to believe in Him,
whether or not we will live for God or just live for ourselves.
And what the best way to answer a prayer is, He is smarter than us.
God wants to do exceedingly abundantly more than we could think or ask.
I do not think you understand how much God loves you.
Do you not think God considered all of mankinds prayers before you were in the womb?
God saw into the future and planned accordingly.
God gives you free will to choose between life or death, good or evil.
But please see God's aching heart for you.
please choose God, please choose life.
before its too late.

Coffrey: "When you talk to God, it's called prayer. When God talks to you, that's insanity" First of all, my simple question is not addressed because again, you're contradictory at best and at worst, flat out ignoring the question.

What does relationship mean to you? Because you talk about communication, but God doesn't talk back. I'm going to assume you way you mean he talks back is in vague "feelings" or something. Let's use you and I as an example. In a God-person relationship, I would ask you whether or not prayer interferes with God's divine plan and then I would get a feeling that would not answer my question because "feelings" have no explanatory power. That's not a relationship, that's a weird mild case of schizophrenia.

Okay, two more questions. So you said he's omniscient, he knows all that ever will be and he already knows that, when he was making a divine plan, doulas was going to make a prayer hoping his steak didn't come out burnt. If that's the case, then prayer is useless because God is already going to choose his actions, am I wrong?
Second question: Choose god before it's too late? What's that mean? Too late for what?

jo2_1990: yes it dose..the God it`s God.and Jesus he man in the End...and we need the pray to ask God save our family and our life ..

Coffrey: I actually agree with you on that, salve.
But to Jo, ask Go to save our family and life from what exactly?

jo2_1990: i asked God when i pray to keep my family in save and still with each other and pray for people who (don`t believe) ther`s no God .to change and open their minds....bcz of God we are here today and alive..not bcz the science...we made the sciencs not it `s made us ! this what i believe and what i pray for

Coffrey: A couple questions first. Has anyone in your family ever died? I just ask because if anyone has, then clearly your prayers weren't getting answered. When you pray to God to change your mind, are you asking him to break my free will?

Science is not a noun, it's a verb. Science is the method in which we understand the very nature that God made, it would exist independent of whether or not we're here. Gravity didn't happen as soon as humans came along, it's always been there. Science made us, not the other way around.

jo2_1990: the 1 answer...no body dead in my family..and i don`t ask God to save them from die**! bcz all of us we will die some day..i ask God to save them from rick or Disease or any thing bad could be happen to any human .....and i don`t ask God change my mind......i asked him change mind of some people don`t believe in God ! ...and i know the science it`s some thing important to our life and we need it to treating many things And such natural phenomena, and the terrain, diseases, etc...but this dosen`t mean ther`s no God bcz we had the science !

jo2_1990: and if us u said the science made us....so we don`t have sex any more !! if the science can made one human...so it`s can made a million of humans..! and this way will be more easier..

Coffrey: Still, you're asking God to change free will? Isn't that why he doesn't just talk to everyone on the planet at once is because it'll affect our free will of whether or not to believe in him?

You're absolutely right, just because we have reliable science doesn't mean there isn't a god. But when people whose sole job is to look at our world, nature, and explain it. Or not even this world, but the universe and the theories and laws governing how things react to each other...... something like 93% of them are atheists. I know that it might be a mild case of argument from authority, but these are the people that can explain God's supposed miracles. Before we explained that our atmosphere are a collection of gases and radiation, the ancient people thought it was a "firmament" something as dense as our ground except being held up by angels or something. Or explaining rain or lightning, where previously it was thought to be an act of God. And those are just a few examples.

I say science created us because we can explain exactly how any human is made. It's not a miracle from god, it's just an act of biology. We can explain it. It doesn't make it any less special or we love our children less because we can actually explain fertilization, it just means we know it now and don't have to go to the non-answer of "It's god's will that we have a baby"

jo2_1990: nothings ther`s called reliable science..bcz the normal human can explain it..not people come from the mars.! did u was there and see how the life stared?who the first person shows on the earth?who had all this Process.? all this only theories suppose the humans not from God `s mad...if God give us the mind not to use it..and say.* we had a science and almost it`s made us ! and bcz of it we live !!! and we have a many things we had it but we don`t see it ! like feelings.! if u can`t see ur feelings face to face or can`t touch it ....is this means..u don`t have it ?so u can`t ask ! i want see God..he give us signs,and we can see it..i know all wat happened and still happen until this day it`s A total of operations and, the Federation of materials with each other..sure we must asked and still asking about this Process bcz we do have mind for reason ! not only for fun ...and u don`t ask ur self..this sun from where it`s come ?this mind hows it`s mad? ur heart how can feel in some thing like hate or love ? and this water hows be like this?and why some this Process ?happened?bcz it`s love us?? how u can believe in some thing don`t have any Senses?is this possible believe in some thing u better more than it ???/or u think it`s the reason u here today?i teel u some thing..ur mind can think and see where`s the wrong and right !! the science can`t do it

Coffrey: On the one hand, you seem to say that firsthand witness is necessary to know something, but then you go into emotions, which you can't see...... so does that mean they don't exist?

Okay, we have a lot of explanations for different things that happen, so you're saying that to know these things, we have to see them. I think that's a poor way to live life, but okay. You have one explanation for all the different things that happen. So have you seen god? Not in that fuzzy sense or seeing signs. In fact, science uses signs to explain nature. Evolution for instance, finding two different species fossils that link back to an ancestor species, that's a sign.

The way that our minds interact with the information we're given through analysis and emotion is simply brain chemistry. I'm sure that you would agree that someone without a brain couldn't reason or feel emotion, so it must be tied to the brain. So we look into the brain to solve these questions. Now explaining what happens in the brain is complicated, very complicated and I'm not sure we have all the answers. But just because we don't have all the answers doesn't mean you can just say god did it. God is everywhere, created everything, does everything, and guides to the correct path if we "listen" to him....... sounds a little like asking a 5 year old to explain the complexities of nature. Give one singular answer that explains nothing, such as where did God come from? Is there a whole race of a deity-like species up there? Who were God's mother and father? That sort of thing.

jo2_1990: and we(the muslims)have book called QURAN*..this book if u just read it u will know howz thif life started on the earth and howz will end to and wat will happen will in Judgment Day ...and can this book show u how the body of human It is formed consisting when he Inside the woman's uterus ...we had this book from more 1550 years ago..in time wasn`t there any scientists or Professor or teacher ! so how we can believe in some thing we al ready have it from along time !!!?