Lost in a Lost World (Page 6)

Fractured fairy tale
Fractured fairy tale: Apparently it was Health care . If you happen to find your self on "the front lines"
Or at "ground zero" or mabye if your just totally Insane . Who Knows
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ghostgeek
ghostgeek: Health care isn't always what it's cracked up to be. Sometimes you get carted into hospital on a stretcher and get trundled out in a box because you've caught something nasty while being on a ward.
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Zanjan
Zanjan: Life is dangerous, you just have to risk it once in a while. One balances the odds by not being entirely reckless.
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Zanjan
Zanjan: As for what propelled humans "to have shaky dominion over the planet earth", I'd say it was a combination of curiosity, need and greed.

Humans are very resourceful when aiming to achieve their ends. Standard practice first employs spies, then applies barter, bribery, extortion, infiltration, religious conversion, and sweet talkin' treaties.

One chooses physical weapons only as the last resort because there's less than a 50% chance of success and the winner has to clean up the mess.
(Edited by Zanjan)
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chronology
chronology: Don't know Zan. People seem to just find themselves in violent circumstances. Both the United States and Vietnam found themselves in a ever escalating spiral of violence with both sides adamant that they would not stand down. The U.S. insisted South Vietnam had a right to choose it's independence from Hanoi. Hanoi insisted it was the rightful Government of South Vietnam not Saigon. Communist countries pourd support into North Vietnam.

Both sides insisted that they were standing up for principal. America said rewarding violence by abandoning South Vietnam set a seriously bad principal. Hanoi insisted it could not allow South Vietnam to break away.

Mr Nixon made the courageous decision to leave Vietnam. But had America not decided to leave, the war would still be going on.

No way people can avoid being trapped in such ways Zan.
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ghostgeek
ghostgeek: Principles can lead to some very unprincipled behaviour.
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chronology
chronology: Don't know ghost, like they say who would want to live in a world with no standards.

Rome passed a law preventing slaves from being castrated by their owners. Jewish circumcision wound up being included in law. Well you can guess how Jewish folk's reacted when the Roman Law was enforced in Judea. They revolted. Jewish folks saw themselves as being true to their religion, the Roman Authorities insisted mutilation of slaves or children would not be allowed. Jews would not back down, Rome would not back down, pretty soon the Roman Legions were marching towards Judea.
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Fractured fairy tale
Fractured fairy tale: Jews and vietnam blahblahblah
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ghostgeek
ghostgeek: According to Josephus, the two main causes of the revolt were the cruelty and corruption of the Roman leaders, and Jewish religious nationalism with the aim of freeing the Holy Land from earthly powers.

[ https://www.historyhit.com/66-ad-was-the-great-jewish-revolt-against-rome-a-preventable-tragedy/ ]

Just goes to prove that two into one doesn't go.
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chronology
chronology: Never heard that one ghost. Rome actually wanted nothing to do with Judea. The only reason Roman Legions were located there was to provide protection to the food trade from Egypt to Rome. Jewish folks were mind controlled by the Babylonian Talmud schools. Babylon at the time was under the control of the Parthian Empire, Rome's old enemy and rival. So Rome trusted the Jewish religious leaders as far as they could throw them. Their loyalty was to Parthia, not Rome.
Cruelty and corruption was standard in that part of the world. Rome would have been no worse than any other government's out there.
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ghostgeek
ghostgeek: During the entire ancient period transport by sea facilitated the movement of bulky and heavy products across long distances, without a prohibitive rise in costs. Nonetheless, whatever the inconveniences of navigation, voyages by sea offered advantages with respect to land transport which was slow, uncomfortable and dangerous. Not to speak of the cargo capacity: several hundred kilogrammes for a cart, hundreds of tonnes for a seagoing vessel. ...

Grain was the basic source of food for the population. According to an anonymous source of the fourth century A.D., under Augustus Egypt sent 20,000,000 modii of grain each year to Rome -- that is, about 140,000 tonnes. According to Flavius Josephus, during Nero’s reign Egyptian grain fed Rome for four months. Each year 60,000,000 modii of grain had to reach Rome by sea -- in other words, 420,000 tonnes or 525,000,000 litres.

In Nero’s time, the arrival of the grain fleet from Alexandria during the month of June was welcomed as an event of great importance. The merchant ships were escorted by warships and preceded by tabellariae ships, which announced the arrival of the fleet which would release the populace from hunger. Seneca has left us a dramatic description of the excitement that would overcome the crowds in the port of Pozzuoli, in the Campania region.

[ https://www2.rgzm.de/navis/Themes/Commercio/CommerceEnglish.htm ]
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Fractured fairy tale
Fractured fairy tale: Fast forward two thousand years whats Changed Isreal is still under Control of same Talmudic Scollars .
But Rome or that the United states bows down to them
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ghostgeek
ghostgeek: Technology is what has made Israel a major world power but the industry that makes it all possible is no longer growing

[ https://www.haaretz.com/israel-news/.premium-the-true-danger-israel-faces-as-startup-nation-starts-to-stumble-1.6510993 ]
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ghostgeek
ghostgeek: Israel’s deepest dilemma is homebred. The difficulty is that growing portions of the population do not fully participate in labor and production. Now, they constitute about 30 percent of Israelis. By 2030 they will be almost 50 percent if current trends hold. It is (as we say here in my base of Germany) as certain as the amen from the pews. This will also be the point at which Israel will cease to exist as a modern economy, open society, and state. This self-destruction is wired into Israeli society and politics. It will happen without Israel’s enemies firing a single shot.

[ http://www.danieldagan.com/?p=87536 ]
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Fractured fairy tale
Fractured fairy tale: Yeah Isreal as a Country has Banked Heavily on Technology. And Dot .com Companies. Everything face book google
Everything is owned by them .
All this Smart Nation stuff will be all our downfalls
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Zanjan
Zanjan: Chron: “No way people can avoid being trapped in such ways Zan.”

I’ll keep my comments about war to a general overview. Humanity used to view conquerors as the strongest people; meanwhile, we’ve since learned there’s no real winner in war. The result is destruction, leaving the facade of peace, which sits on a hair trigger.

We know that victory belongs to those with the right aim, to the worthiest of causes. That was not the case with America’s intervention in Veitnam. America was motivated by fear – fear of communism. That venture was doomed from the start; it was just a matter of realizing the error and taking a bow.

America is not the world’s police force. The right of authority to make a move is given to the United Nations, of which America is a member. America didn’t respect its rules and ran off, doing its own thing. That has never worked nor will it ever. Obedience to the proper authority is the way not to fall into traps. In every endeavour, one should consult with others.

“Cruelty and corruption was standard in that part of the world. Rome would have been no worse than any other government's out there.”

You’re right. Just brought to mind the story of the warrior Queen Boudicca in her battles with Rome. Both sides were mercilessly cruel but for different reasons. She was driven by wrath and Rome was driven by greed. Neither are worthy causes.

Sadly, they didn’t have the means and tools we do today. For us, there’s no excuse to start a war or permit others to do so. The world stage is the team with the greater eye.
(Edited by Zanjan)
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ghostgeek
ghostgeek: So how come the Korean war turned out different to the Vietnam war?
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Zanjan
Zanjan: Nobody actually won the Korean War. Technically, the war goes on to this day, since the combatants never signed a peace treaty, albeit the supposed armistice was in 1953. I think of it as a fizzle into cold war; now it's just some posturing.

There were a lot of outside players in that war - everybody jumped into the fray. The North had China and Russia as their allies but the South had the United Nations to back them.. about 20 major countries at the time.

One hears a lot of noise when slowly letting the air out of a balloon. Unity is the most powerful force there is. Today, all countries in the world are members of the United Nations - they all know what happens if one goes rogue past their own borders.

Some say the United Nations is too slow to act. What they don't realize is that, sometimes, opposing countries are able to work out their differences on their own, given a bit more time for negotiation, while other countries are quite capable of defending themselves.

The UN isn't a dictator - a country has to ask it for help.
(Edited by Zanjan)
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ghostgeek
ghostgeek: Mmm ... it seems to me that the big difference is that America didn't walk away from Korea. They still have military forces there. With Vietnam they signed a peace agreement and scuttled off back to America.
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Fractured fairy tale
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Zanjan
Zanjan: Ghost, US troops are only in South Korea, which pays them to be there for protection. Not cheap.
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Zanjan
Zanjan: Fractured, if one wanted to know the Jewish opinion on Jesus, they shouldn't choose some random young pup, any extremist group, or secular Jews to speak for their nation.

No scripture on earth approves any future religion - they only state God will send another Prophet after their own, *one just like their own*. Ergo, Jews have ground and are bound to respect any future prophet, not necessarily adopt a newer religion. God prefers personal readiness and forbids compulsion.

Meanwhile, everyone knows they don't believe Jesus is *their* Messiah. Like Christians, they're still waiting for the appropriate Messiah to come along - one that suits them best. There's nothing wrong with that. What WOULD be wrong is to attack any of them or their followers.

Unlike most Christians, the majority of faithful Jews respect all religions. This is why God forgave them and graces them with all the time they need to make ready for the messiah of their choice.

(Edited by Zanjan)
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Zanjan
Zanjan: Since God forgave them, you'd better too, else it's your butt that will be kissing the flames.
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ghostgeek
ghostgeek: This is a strange God believers believe in. According to them it created a rational being, then demands from it blind, unthinking obedience. How potty can you get?
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Zanjan
Zanjan: Since when? He didn't make us automatons. I wouldn't mind being a puppet - I'd never make any mistakes; but, that's not how our existence works.

Man has intellect; with it, he must think, choose, and create wisely. Since he doesn't know what's best for himself, he can't do that alone. God asks man to turn to Him for the right guidance, not to fools.
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