what about the war? how can win the war?

wind_lu: first,i declare that i am not warmonger. and then, i want to say war is good medicine for the country whose politics and economy is very very bad.
how to win the war? i only want to emphasize "ruthless".you can see USA how to do in the second world war,and the result;and USA hot to do at Afghanistan,and the result.
by the way ,i also want to say i hate the war.
what do you think?

Captain Canada: War is a industry just like any other industry
Make money

Outbackjack: Revolution!

wind_lu: yeah,revolution,on one hand destroying wealth on the other hand making money and wish.

SWlNE: War for the sake of war, Wind Lu?

chronology: The war has been won. The terror organising out posts have been smashed and the murderous thugs who would sit around laughing at the deaths of Americans have been swept away thanks to the sacrifices by U.S. girls and boys.

SWlNE: You have a very romantic view of WWII. Too many Pearl Habour and Inglorious Bastards hollywood movies for you, Chronology.

chronology: wind lu was refering to Afghanistan. Never saw Inglorious Bastards. never seen any Pearl harbour Movies, but did read 'From Here to Eternity' it was a good book.

And I will repeat, the American girls and boys have done a great service in Afghanistan, God Bless them all.

SWlNE: He was referring to WWII as well and as I recall NATO was involved in Afghanistan. (remember the International Security Assistance Force). Or you forgot the others who are involved heavily in WWII and the assistance in Afghanistan. The results of the latter can be seen now.

chronology: Never knew people from Bokata were so particular about the minutiar of the composition of NATO Forces. But for your information, 90pc of the Service Personnel in Afghanistan were from the United States of America, 80pc of the Landing Forces on Normandy Beaches were American. American Tax Payers picked up the Bill for both wars. Am I belittling other nations contribution in both liberations? no, but you are from the deeply involved slopes of Bokata making it look that way.

SWlNE:
I am a man of accuracy and I know the composition of the NATO forces who were involved in Afghanistan. A lot of non-Americans.

Also the larger contribution of non-Americans to WWII. If you are trying to hint towards WWII as the US as having the largest contribution, you'll be surprise to know that in terms of numbers they were not and you might be surprise to know too that the citizens of the other countries involved also payed taxes and paid through blood as well. Then again maybe that bit of news haven't reached you yet. Wherever you're from.

I guess you were being inaccurate and more slanting towards patriotism than on the contributions of others to the unnecessary Middle Eastern war. Carry on.

chronology: Pigggledy. Am not sure what point you are making. Yes 90pc of German casualties in WW2 was on the Eastern Front fighting Russia, actually, only 40pc of those killed there wearing German Uniforms were 'German' most were Ukrainians, Italians, ethnic Russians used in the German Front Line, and numbers of others from a bunch of nations. There was even a 'British' SS Regiment, 'SS GB' . The members of that Unit were hanged when captured by British Military Police later on while they were on the run after the war.

Again 90pc of all Liberation troops in Afghanistan were Americans, same with the Liberation of Iraq. Am simply giving credit where credit is due.

Yes Great Britain paid a heavy financial price for WW2, Britain only finished paying off it's WW2 debts around 8 years ago. The American only asked for 40 cents on the dollar of those debts as a sign of good will. But Britain still paid up up it's responsibilities.

The Western Front War Effort of WW2 was almost entirely funded by the U.S.A. as was the war fought against Imperial Japanese Forces.

Am not belittling any other country, but give credit where credit is due. If you want to be a stickler for facts, then give the Russians the credit for defeating Germany in WW2. The Russians also recieved convoy aid from the ships sailing from New York City, with U.S. Merchant Marine running the 'Torpedo Alley' of the Atlantic. Credit where credit is due pigggley.

SWlNE:
I am giving credit where it is due, hence why I mentioned the input (larger) of non-US soldiers long before the US decided to join in WWII. It's too common that these are not mentioned in WWII discussions (mainly by persons who are from the US). I don't know if it is because it is not mentioned in the school curriculum there or that patriotism means taking the full credit. Who knows.


The British also financed the Soviets, the Soviets also financed the Soviets with even women sacrificing, working in the factories. So? A lot can be said but I don't have the time to go through each with you. I will though during the week.

Pragmatic Aristocrat: As Roosevelt said "Walk quietly with a big stick".

chronology: Piggledy. Actually few Americans knew anything about the sacrifice and bravery of American sailors on the Arctic Convoys to Russia. Even at the time, some folks did not want to help Russia, and there was always the unspoken feeling among many Navy Guys and Merchant Marine Guys that they were on their own in their hazardous and freezing rescue missions to Russia. I have personally spoken to some Guys who were on the 'Arctic Convoys' . Folks in New York City were also heroes in their own way. They kept sailing times and destinations secret of ships leaving the dock. People from different walks of life, and different ethnic backgrounds. Like in that Ethan Hawke movie 'Precinct 13' . But they managed to keep together like Ethan Hawks friends.

SWlNE: What in my post are you referring to? The word 'actually' suggests a link but I'm not seeing it.

chronology: you were referring to school curriculums in the U.S.

As far as I know, the Baltic Convoys were hardly referred to in U.S. schools.

SWlNE:
Yes, I was referring to the teaching of the Soviet's contribution in the WWII efforts. Even though their contribution was very vast and one of the many deciding factors on the way the war turned.

SWlNE: The Arctic convoys was a joint effort by the Allies. There were also several convoys in WWII.

chronology: pigggldy, three subjects have fascinated Americans over the years; Jesus Christ, the American Civil War, and the Titanic disaster.

Americans had little interest in who was killing who or why in Europe, the blood lust in Europe seemed insane to them.

SWlNE:
It is not a matter of interest, but a matter on what is taught. WWII is an extremely important aspect of mankind's history. Accept it or not it has shaped the world (much like its predecessor). To summarise it as 'the blood lust in Europe' is a bit...naive to me and slightly ignorant.

The toll the Soviets took economically in WWII was extremely large. It was more than the other participants of WWII.
I do think that a large amount of that was covered by the Soviets themselves and the lesser by the UK-US. There were several elements involved in that war that pumped the Soviet machine. There were the Gulag prisoners, the labour of the Soviet citizens themselves, and much more.


I have not watched the 'Precinct 13'. I imagine that it's another hollywood 'good guys save' movie which tend to be different in real life. There lacks that black & white line in warfare. I recall reading of the treatment of the Japanese (and descendants) by the US 'folks'. These dark shadows in war time are hardly mentioned (if ever mentioned). Maybe it makes the 'little interest' list.

chronology: Yes I know the Arctic Convoys were a joint Allied effort, I have spoken personally to men who were on the 'Ark Angel' run.

'Niave Blood lust' of Europe, you have got to be joking. 50.000 men in the British Army died within 5 hours of the battle of the Somme. And 150.000 men were injured in the same first day of the battle. That is around the same number of men lost in 15 years of Vietnam.

The problem with Europe is that Europe gloried and revelled in war, Americans were still haunted by the memories of Gettysburg and Bull Run even in 1914. 'Assault on Precinct 13' was a movie about defending a man who some characters in the Movie thought was not worth defending, some thought that about the Soviets in the U.S. in WW2. But thousands of sailors risked their lives to help defend the Soviets with vital aid shipments.

SWlNE:
Yeah, I don't care who you had a chit-chat with.

You summed up WW 2 as the 'blood lust' of Europe. The war was a lot more. Yes men and women died and blood was split but that is what WAR is. There is not a war that no one lost their lives in. That is naive and ignorant to me. Vietnam you say? Do you know the number of civilians that died by the US Agent Orange in that war? And you talk about blood lust.

Europe gloried and revelled in the war? What nonsense are you talking, Chronology. WWII has left its scar on Europe. War is a dirty business, there is very little to glorify.

The moment you try to apply some Hollywood event to a real life event is the moment I take you less seriously. Don't even step in that direction.

What the Soviets did, no other country would've been able to have done. No country would've been able to take on Germany and its supporters alone. What it took to sustain that machine was more than aid ships, it was a joint effort by the Soviets themselves and the Allies. I know the US came in late but many others were already involved and continued to the end. If you want to dish out credit then there you have your rightful targets.

chronology: Usual anti American rant.

As some one said; 'you have let your heart be darkened by that darkest of sins, the sin of ingratitude' . 'Agent Orange' ? I take it Columbia's exports to the U.S. are all health promoting then.

SWlNE:
Yes, I guess pointing on the true history of WWII is anti-American. Is that how you feel? That you need to say the envoys were US instead of what they were? -that is a joint effort on by the Allies. It is anti-American to admit that the vast import was actually not the US? I'm glad that that is all you can say to my postings instead of keeping it formal and responding directly to what was posted. Shows that there is nothing to object to.

Colombia's (note the spelling) drug exports (note that you can say it and not be passive aggressive about it) are from the drug cartels not something supported by the Colombian people and I do recall the US having a dirty habit of loving to import and export it themselves along with other things. I take it that it's anti-American to state that as well.

Now about Agent Orange, that wasn't some underworld drug cartel, that was something supported and done by your US government. I'm sure the Vietnamese were grateful for that. Who knows.

chronology: This is just becoming a rant on your part.

But I really do think that a person who lives in a country which has supplied the narcotics that has destroyed the lives of millions of America's is the least worthy to be sitting in judgment of the U.S.A.