Bachmann and 4 other Republicans claim Islamist infiltration in US, McCain fires back

Sarcastic Dots: This is just getting sad. Really sad.

WASHINGTON — Accusations by Rep. Michele Bachmann, R-Minn., that an Islamist group has infiltrated the U.S. government are drawing fierce criticism from fellow lawmakers and religious groups.

Bachmann and four other GOP legislators have sent letters to five government agencies citing “serious security concerns” about what Bachmann has called a “deep penetration in the halls of our United States government” by the Muslim Brotherhood.

Bachmann also accused Huma Abedin, an aide to Secretary of State Hillary Rodham Clinton and former Rep. Anthony Weiner’s wife, of having family connections to the Muslim Brotherhood.

Sen. John McCain, R-Ariz., defended Abedin. “These attacks on Huma have no logic, no basis and no merit, and they need to stop now,” he said in a Senate speech on Wednesday (July 18).

Bachmann’s letters cite a report by Frank Gaffney, a conservative who has accused President Obama of “embracing the agenda of the Muslim Brotherhood.”

Gaffney has also argued that most U.S. mosques have been radicalized by Islamists, a claim that government terrorism officials have called “inaccurate and counterproductive,” according to The Washington Post.

The Muslim Brotherhood is an Islamist political movement founded in Egypt in 1928 with branches in several other Arab states.

The Bachmann letters “asking for investigations of American Muslims are cause for concern and give an undeserved and harmful platform to fringe accusations,” said Christina Warner, director of the interfaith organization Shoulder-to-Shoulder.

Sarcastic Dots: Rabbi David Saperstein, director of the Religious Action Center of Reform Judaism, said that Bachmann’s accusations “reflect a general pattern of Islamophobia that touches too many areas of our society.”

“Allegations such as these by members of Congress add legitimacy to this distressing trend,” Saperstein said.

Rep. Keith Ellison, D-Minn., a Muslim, suggested that Bachmann was using the accusations for political gain and asked for evidence to back her claims.

“Your response simply rehashes claims that have existed for years on anti-Muslim websites and contains no reliable information that the Muslim Brotherhood has infiltrated the U.S. government,” Ellison wrote in a letter to Bachmann.

McCain's full statement: http://www.mccain.senate.gov/public/index.cfm?FuseAction=PressOffice.PressReleases&ContentRecord_id=9acf4627-0fad-89d1-d5d3-dda642179bca

Source: http://www.washingtonpost.com/nation...KuW_print.html

Sarcastic Dots: Bachmann's former campaign chief -- shame on you, Michele: http://www.foxnews.com/opinion/2012/07/18/bachmann-former-campaign-chief-shame-on-michele/

Her unsubstantiated charge against Abedin, a widely respected top aide to Secretary Hillary Clinton, accusing her of some sort of far-fetched connection to the Muslim brotherhood, is extreme and dishonest.

Having worked for Congressman Bachman’s campaign for president, I am fully aware that she sometimes has difficulty with her facts, but this is downright vicious and reaches the late Senator Joe McCarthy level. (Joe McCarthy falsely made claims that there were large numbers of Communists and Soviet spies inside the State Department in the early 1950’s. On December 2, 1954, the Senate voted to "condemn" McCarthy on two counts.)

"Having worked for Congressman Bachman’s campaign for president, I am fully aware that she sometimes has difficulty with her facts,"

LAUGH OUT LOUD. Even her former team are laughing at her.

lavendar_star: WOW, that is crazy but I have seen those claims made by a few members on wire club, when they have directed me to so called evidence it comes from a right wing Christian website with no credible sources to back it up and the only other websites that can support their claims are far right websites and that's self explanatory.

I think the reference to the red scare in 1950s America is relevant as that seem to be the thing that is happening now with Muslims. On someones feeds on their homepage they mentioned that their southern state was going to allow a mosque to be built despite violent protest (which they thought was good as you know freedom of religion) then someone of his friends list commented that Muslims are all evil and trying to take over America.

Its strange that a country with a legacy of state sanctioned racism i.e. Jim crow laws don't learn from the past in relation to bigotry and prejudices. Its scary that people that should be educated and reasonable would now call for American Muslims to be investigated and that there is a secret plot to take over America, i suspect that they are tapping into and playing on the fears that some Americans do have. Its staggering we have some dodgy politicians in the UK but they seems far better then these loons in the US, I suspect there is a us- Euro Christians versus them Arab-other Muslims vibe going on too. sad

StuckInTheSixties:

Bachmann is notoriously loony and demagogic, but let's not forget that four of her fellow members of congress accompanied her in writing that McCarthyesque letter to the State Department:

Louie Gohmert (Republican, Texas)
Lynn Westmoreland (Republican, Georgia)
Trent Franks (Republican, Arizona)
Thomas Rooney (Republican, Florida)

The letter is a matter of public record, seen here in this PDF:

http://bachmann.house.gov/uploadedfiles/ig_letter_dept_of_state.pdf

Sarcastic Dots: This report covers all of them pretty well:

StuckInTheSixties:

Speaking of modern-day Congressional McCarthyesque demagogery, how about the wonderful Rep. Allen West (Rep. Florida), that (seriously) said during a question and answer session in April of 2012:

"I believe there's about 78 to 81 members of the Democrat Party who are members of the Communist Party."



Politifact, rating this commentary on their "Truth-O-Meter," gave this bit of craziness their (liar liar) "Pant On Fire" rating.

http://www.politifact.com/florida/statements/2012/apr/11/allen-west/allen-west-says-about-80-house-democrats-are-membe/

(By the way, the politifact page gives access to another version of this same video, unavailable elsewhere, with that poor quality audio cleaned up a bit and with clearer audibility.)

the real slim DEEPy: BACHMAN IS SORT OF AN AIRHEAD, but doesnt anyone remember how quickly obama fed our longstandint egyptian ally mubarec to the revolutionaries, knowing that the muslim brotherhood was infiltrating the rebels and pushing to post mubarek leadership, the obama administration said that the muslim brotherhood is not an extremist group. this is not true, the muslim brotherhod wishes to lead egypt to was with israel, they wish to kill egyptian christians and instill sharia law. what is the point of giving egyptians democrocy if they vote to opress themselves. then, not getting into any birther garbage, remember how barak obamas dad waqs a muslim, and islam is always passed from father to son.

i think bachmann was jumping to conclusions, but she had ressonable suspicion, as i have just laid out. obamas birth as a muslim, and his voluntarily taking of his fathers muslim name are not good signs to a semi-crackpot.

as far as alan wast's comment, he was referring to the american progressive party, and wasnt completely accurte in calling them socialists. they are actually more akin to facists, and hillary clintom, gw bush, mccain and obama are all part of the progressive political movement. progressivism does not call for communism, but for a mixed market economy with big government to right the wrongs of happenstance, from cradle to grave. progressivism is the american answer to facism and comm unism, it is an american tradition, and is very destructive to the economy. but they are not alleged communists, they are progressives, the american facism...

StuckInTheSixties:

No, you got it wrong.

He didn't call them socialists. He said that they were members of the Communist Party. It's right there in the video. He actually says that.

And saying they're "akin to fascists" is absurd, like painting a Hitler mustache on the politician of your choice. As usual, you're not to be taken seriously.

And referring to Bachmann as "sort of an airhead" is like referring to Krakatoa as "sort of a volcano."

Nice rant, by the way.

StuckInTheSixties:

Shit, how did I miss this:

"islam is always passed from father to son."



I shall now refer to you as Bachmann.

lavendar_star: Please provide proof that Islam is passed from father and son, you normally follow the religion of the parent you were raised with which is his American Mother if his parents stayed together that would have more validity. As for the rest : The websites that support those claims are very dubious I know Ive seen them due to others sharing your opinion. Gosh people do like conspiracies.

the real slim DEEPy: socialist and communist is interchangeable in my book, one is just a stepping stone to the other. the american progressive (economic system) was introduced into us politics by fdr as an answer to the overproduction of facism. it is a form of corporatistic economics, as is facism. progressivism is as much akin facism as socialism is to communism, a petty distinction. america has been a progressive facism since fdr.

alan west confused porgressivism for communism because, well, they are similarly economically. they depend on union uprisings, government control, war, propoganda, an executivebrance equally powerful as the legisive. the progressives are open in their affilliation, and many are or were members of the trilateral commission or other "secret societies". this would get the ears perked of any conspiracy theorist. in this day and age, conspiricy thinking is actually pretty sane considering how crazy the world is getting. todays world can make it easy for a same individual to go off his rocker, and mixing progressivism with communism isnt too far off the rocker, since they stand for a lot of the same things.

look up "progressivism" on wikipedia, and you will see that it is an offshoot of facism.: or, if you dont think you need to visit wikipedia, please explain progressivism to me in your own words... credibility, whatever, my credibility is only marred by your lack of factual information about econ omics

the real slim DEEPy: and i never said i shared baccmanns point of view. i even insulted her.i was explaining her point of view as being not so insane as you insinuated my point is that there are reasons for a bible thumpin fanatic to fear an islamic inflitration. dont forget how warm the ground zero islamic memorial to the world trade center was recieved... there are lots of christian fundies that think obama, while not a muslim, is very sympathetic to muslims, overly so, and there is evidence of this, such as him bowing to the saudi king, and his favoritism of the muslim brotherhood over an ally like mubarek.

you act like someone is loony if they say something that isnt pc, but, you know what, the world isnt always pc. sometimes there are evil jewish bankers, and not in movies, but in real life. and just cause someone says, look out for the evil jewish banker, that doesnt necesarrily mean that they are anti-semetic., but anti-evil. there are many peaceful muslims(and jews), but the ones that make the news are terrorrists, so thats what midland america sees- not that every muslim is dangerous, but that a good bit might be. you gotta admit, 9/11 was a prety shit-poor peace pipe from our friends in the midle east. and fear is very powerful. fear can easily overpower rational thinking, and its not considered a mental illness if society, religion or culture brings the phobia on.

StuckInTheSixties:

Very duncanesque ...

lavendar_star: On the wiki article now where does it mention fascism and the article is disputed for its neutrality as well making it very unreliable, but they do mention social democracy which is the European version of progressivism accoridng to them and no way in Europe or the UK, Australia or Canada do we live in a fascist state. I would think people in Europe would know that considering Mussolini etc and all. In Europe and the UK which i know people who advocate your opinion wrongly like to demonise and parade as the doomed future of America.

We had the most Capitalist loving Prime minster in the UK between 1979-1990s and we had the most strikes, war propaganda well that depends how you define it (if you mean your former President and my former Prime minster lying and saying there was weapons of mass destruction to go to war) you may have a point but even in the second world war there was war propaganda by the allies.

StuckInTheSixties:

"look up "progressivism" on wikipedia, and you will see that it is an offshoot of facism."

A swing an' a miss!

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Progressivism

lavendar_star: You have done it with the evil jewish bankers I defo know what type of websites you visit lol, and we have the same thing in the UK with the Muslims and the politicians over here accused of favouring them. gosh I think our politicians have done the same thing with the Saudis as did your former President. * which just make our credibility zero considering how that country treats women) and they werent a fan of Murback either but they have Anglo surnames so the accusations are not wild and rampant.

the real slim DEEPy: social democrocy is a weak socialism. i said akin to facism, how akin depends who is in the white house.

wikipedia-corporatism

Corporatist types of community and social interaction are common to many ideologies, including: absolutism, capitalism, conservatism, FASCISM liberalism, progressivism, reactionism, social democracy, socialism, and syndicalism

we were progressive duing WWII, remember fdr had it introduced into our system, since you nentioned the allies propoganda

StuckInTheSixties:

I copied and pasted your exact words.

Now you're just pretending you didn't say what you said.

the real slim DEEPy: sixties, it happens to bpart of thr diagnosis criteria for paraniod schitzophrenia that it cannot be attributable to culture, religion or upbringing. bachmnn and wst arent insane, they hsve just been deeply exposed to some very inflamitory thought that, while, not accurate, very difficult to distinguish.

i assumed the bachman knock was to show her a loony, so i kindly provided toe diagnosis criteria for paranoid schitzophrenia, the only condition fitting your description of her.

StuckInTheSixties:

Bachmann is a loony. But my assumption was that the original post was meant to show her (and the other four) as a demagog.

Kinda like you.

lavendar_star: So obama is a fascist and a Muslim and of course a anti Christ lol

OK but that statement does not say that fascism and Progressivism are the same thing or akin to one another as your could say that anyone who promotes capitalism or conservatism is also akin fascist according to your logic.

lavendar_star: Here is the http://www.britannica.com/EBchecked/topic/202210/fascism lengthy and detailed definition of fascism which for me is more reliable then wikipedia.

the real slim DEEPy: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Corporatism

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Third_Way_(centrism)

In 2004, several veteran U.S. Democrats founded a new Washington, DC organization entitled Third Way, which bills itself as a "strategy center for progressives

Position on class conflict: class compromise

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Social_corporatism

Some controversy has existed in the political left over social corporatism on the issue of class conflict, it has been identified in a critical manner by some on the revolutionary left as a form of regulated capitalism that has abandoned the concept of class conflict between the bourgeoisie and the proletariat in its recognition of private property and for placing privately-owned enterprise on an equal level to trade unions.[4] Others on the left counter these criticisms by the revolutionary left by claiming that social corporatism has been progressive in providing institutional legitimacy to the labour movement that recognizes the existence of ongoing class conflict between the bourgeoisie and the proletariat but seeks to provide peaceful resolutions to disputes arising from the conflict based on moderation rather than revolution.[5] Thus proponents of social corporatism consider it a class compromise within the context of existing class conflict.[6]

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fascism

Fascists claim that their ideology is a trans-class movement, advocating resolution to domestic class conflict within a nation to secure national solidarity.[19] It claims that its goal of cultural nationalization of society emancipates the nation's proletariat, and promotes the assimilation of all classes into proletarian national culture.[

Mussolini claimed that Italian Fascism's economic system of corporatism could be identified as state capitalism which he claimed was state socialism "turned on its head", which in either case involved "the bureaucratisation of the economic activities of the nation."[

lavendar_star: You have copied and pasted sections of wikipedia to fit your views so I shall do the same from the same wiki articles but showing the opposite view point.
"en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fascism

"Fascism was founded during World War I by Italian national syndicalists who combined left-wing and right-wing political views.[6][7] Fascists have commonly opposed having a firm association with any section of the left-right spectrum, considering it inadequate to describe their beliefs,[8][9] though fascism's goal to promote the rule of people deemed innately superior while seeking to purge society of people deemed innately inferior is identified as a prominent far-right theme.[10] Fascism opposes multiple ideologies: conservatism, liberalism, and the two major forms of socialism — communism and social democracy, and denounce them as representatives of sectarian interests rather than the community as a whole.[11] To achieve its goals, the fascist state purges forces, ideas, people, and systems deemed to be the cause of decadence and degeneration.[12] Fascism promotes political violence and war as forms of direct action that promote national rejuvenation, spirit and vitality.[3][13] Fascists commonly utilize paramilitary organizations to commit or threaten violence against their opponents.[14]


en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Social_corporatism
"Social corporatism is a form of economic tripartite corporatism supported by social democratic political parties based upon "social partnership" between capital and labour interest groups as well as between the market economy and state regulation that is considered a compromise to regulate conflict between capital and labour by mandating them to engage in mutual consultations based that are mediated by the government.[1][2] Social corporatism developed in the post-World War II period. Social corporatism has been developed by social democrats in European countries such as Austria, Norway, Germany and Sweden.[3]"


en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Third_Way_(centrism)

"The term was later used by politicians in the 1990s who wished to incorporate Margaret Thatcher and Ronald Reagan's projects of economic deregulation, privatization, and globalization into the mainstream centre-left political parties.

In the last decade the Third Way can be defined as:
..Something different and distinct from liberal capitalism with its unswerving belief in the merits of the free market and democratic socialism with its demand management and obsession with the state. The Third Way is in favour of growth, entrepreneurship, enterprise and wealth creation but it is also in favour of greater social justice and it sees the state playing a major role in bringing this about. So in the words of... Anthony Giddens of the LSE the Third Way rejects top down socialism as it rejects traditional neo liberalism.
—Report from the BBC, 1999, [7]
[edit]Examples

OCD_OCD: Allen West was likening the Congressional Progressive Caucus to the Communist party.

Moderator: "What percentage of the American legislature do you think are card-carrying Marxists or International Socialist?"

West: "It's a good question. I believe there's about 78 to 81 members of the Democrat Party who are members of the Communist Party. ... It’s called the Congressional Progressive Caucus."

So how many -- if any -- Democrats in Congress are communists?

West points to the Progressive Caucus

We asked West’s spokeswoman Angela Melvin for an explanation: "The congressman was referring to the 76 members of the Congressional Progressive Caucus. The Communist Party has publicly referred to the Progressive Caucus as its allies. The Progressive Caucus speaks for itself. These individuals certainly aren't proponents of free markets or individual economic freedom."

On Facebook, West elaborated: "I stand by the point of my comments. The press wants to write gotcha stories and talk semantics, but just look at the words and actions of the Progressive Caucus. You can call them socialist, Marxist, communist or whatever you want, but the point is, they oppose free markets and individual economic freedom, they want to redistribute wealth, and they want to see the nation fundamentally transformed. Their policies are destructive and I will stand up to them regardless of the critics. Members of this Caucus lavished praise on Fidel Castro following a 2009 visit, just to name one example. The Communist Party USA claims the Progressive Caucus as its ‘ally.’"