call me stupid ...

ColonelKusanagi: but they're talking about people renting because they can't get approved for a mortgage. my question: why should a house cost more than many people make in their lifetime? we could do a lot to get rid of these corrupt middle men without the astronomical inflation.

KrAsH15: Stupid!! (you told me to)

Houses don't cost more then you will earn in your lifetime unless your on minimum wage at mcd's or somewhere similar which if the case you need to get yourself a higher paying job.

Where im from im glad i dont have to buy a house now though,the prices are forever going up,and im really glad i dont have to pay rent cos rental payments are more then mortgage payments.

Guess another option is if you dont have heaps of money is again where im from you can get a housing commision home (think their called council homes in the uk) and pay lesser rent then a normal rent payer and after a few years you can buy that housing commision home just by continuing to pay your rent.

ColonelKusanagi: remember when they announced McDonalds was hiring and thousands of people showed up? college graduates jumping at the chance to flip burgers? maybe you missed that. it's ever so unfortunate but it is a fact.

as for housing comisions, we don't have them here but it's possible there is something similar. either way, something's got to give.

salisburycin: The home values did increase with value but the paychecks of the wage earner's did not. Plus most households have 2 incomes. That started after the women's lib movement which i can't help but to wonder if that was a planned thing. Krash, what you have that is called council homes are what we in the US call section-8 homes. Colonel, here in NC, the community colleges are cranking out nurses, cops and biotechnicians (mainly). That makes me go hummmmm

ColonelKusanagi: lmao i was thinking section 8 but those are crack houses and it never leads to ownership of any kind. don't forget fitness majors. no more innovators, engineers or anything useful. education has skyrocketed and a college degree has never been worth less. perhaps section 8 means something other than crack house outside of newark but if it does i don't know it.

salisburycin: lol i know but section-8 is housing that is provided. Actually I think you have to pay according to your income? We have people addicted to drugs down here too but don't forget about the women who act like baby factories too. Those womenm make out better if they DON"T work. Fitness majors? OMG BAHAHAHA girl you are too much! We had a curves down here once and in no time they closed their doors due to lack of people joining. There's not many people who care to work out in my area but the YMCA seems to do pretty well. I saw alot of traffic while going to physical therphy. The traffic was of people who had gotton hurt on the job mostly. Their bodies breaking down from working hard all their life. Innovators, we still have "seen on tv" hehe well we do still innovate but other countries **uhem china** copy what we do innovate. College. I am in a college right now and I must say that you have to take a bunch of b/s classes before actually taking the classes that pertain to the major that you are going for. And it seems that you have to have a degree of some sort to get a decent job these days. Decent meaning, income that is just enough for one person to survive on.

Outbackjack: Its an unfortunate fact but the "free loving" baby boomer generation sold out their Grandchildren through the "greed is good" mantra.

Baby Boomers sit on their fat land titles which they now pass onto the next generation at exorbitant prices.They have also have passed on record government and private debt,in most Western Countries,to a generation which isnt even born yet.Generation Z will continue to pay for our excesses long after the Baby boomers have passed away.

Generation Y has little choice but a life of wage slavery if they want to live in a capital city in Australia.

I am glad I bought land when it was cheap and for cash.

I pity my children when they want to own their own home.

salisburycin: It truely is sad and once your body is worn down from slaving for decades they rather that you just die. In the U.S. the real reason that some of the politicians want to allow peoples from Mexico to be here is for tax revenue, more slaves. We are 15 Trillion in debt and still counting. There's still double digit unemployment which means that there's not enough jobs for the US citizens much less Mexicans. You are right about the debt being passed on for generations but not all baby boomers have titles to property in fact many have lost their retirement. I suspect that the next bubble to pop will be all the education loans that were approaved. Bush and O'bama have been putting band-aids on the economy to keep us from falling into a Depression like in the 30's. They have had the presses working over time to create money, de-valuing our dollar. I feel that the beginning of this mess was with Clinton's NAFTA agreement, the wall street, banking and housing markets is what added fuel to the fire. Why did the price of Petro? It $3.25 a gallon here where I live. How much is it where you live Jack?

ohnonotthatguy: yeah lets just blame OLD GREED for all problems/costs onto our daily lives
We want to make more money,better homes,better cars we want everything better and its so easy to get all that,just become greedier and greedier everyday till you get what you want.

Wow Petro at 3.25 no that bad,would you like to pay 5.50 per gallon like we do in Canada

Yeah almost forgot,that gas that you pay 3.25 per gallon is pure gas from Canada.
Just how that got to be you may ask?
That nasty NAFTA accord

salisburycin: OhNoNotThatGuy!!! Love the screen name haha! Well greed yes but power too, and then add in the problems that we create for ourselves. We get petro from Canada but not just Canada. Isn't Canadian oil sucked out of the dirt? Seems like I read that some place. We can do that ourselves but we rather use up the rest of the world's resources I guess. (Ex President Bush was a oil man as was his daddy). Anywho, when I went truck shopping that was why I bought a lil truck instead of a full sized one. Maybe we should go back to the steam engine technology since all this global warming is suppose to make the oceans rise (being a smartazz here). And where's all the green energy technology that I have heard about for years? It may come down to this to heat my house:
http://www.sunshinesimple.com/

ohnonotthatguy: Awe.Thanks on the name thing
With Greed comes Power generates more Greed and more Power etc,etc.
True not only from Canada your rob oil,and claiming its American oil.
you said"We can do that ourselves but we rather use up the rest of the world's resources I guess." hahahhaha USA don't have the money nor the oil-sands and the expertise to accomplish such thing
USA is broke no cash,no dineros and it will get worse by the day

Outbackjack: We are paying around the $6AU mark a gallon in the bush and the irony is we drive big distances in big cars.Need a larger car on some of these roads as some of the smaller 4 cylinders can sometimes literally shake to pieces over time.

LPG is used to power a lot of cars here.It is a plentiful by product that costs around 70 cents a litre and has slightly lower emission but unfortunately doesnt last as well as petrol when you compare MPG.

ohnonotthatguy: I agree with mr.Outbackjack on the small cars thing falling apart on rough roads
I drive a dodge ram 2500 series with a diesel puller in it no gas engines for this guy

salisburycin: OhNoooooo!!! Yeah you right, we are 15 Trillion in debt and have been printing and borrowing money all the way. Wait until they build the road that connects all 3 countries and see what happens. Also, the 3 currencys will be changed too. I believe its going to be called the Amero. It don't matter because they are gonna shove a chip under our skin anyhow.

Jack, it doesn't seem to matter how high gas gets in price in the area where I live because people refuse to give up their full sized trucks and suv's, but the gas mileage has improved alot and continues to do so each year. The auto makers on my lil truck says to change the oil every 5K but i don't trust that so I pull the dip stick out and look at the color of the oil. If its getting burnt then it gets changed because I am not allowing it to sludge up any faster than it already will just because they say to change it at 5K.

Sarcastic Dots: You guys should really look into the constitution of Carolina by John Locke. Property shouldn't be awarded on the basis of wealth, it should be awarded on the bases of work. Period.


From wiki

Locke uses the word property in both broad and narrow senses. In a broad sense, it covers a wide range of human interests and aspirations; more narrowly, it refers to material goods. He argues that property is a natural right and it is derived from labour.

In Chapter V of his Second Treatise, Locke argues that the individual ownership of goods and property is justified by the labour exerted to produce those goods or utilise property to produce goods beneficial to human society.[20]

Locke stated his belief, in his Second Treatise, that nature on its own provides little of value to society; he provides the implication that the labour expended in the creation of goods gives them their value. This is used as supporting evidence for the interpretation of Locke's labour theory of property as a labour theory of value, in his implication that goods produced by nature are of little value, unless combined with labour in their production and that labour is what gives goods their value.[20]

ohnonotthatguy: Mr Dots That was great thinking in the 1600s
If I was to be payed for my labour in land i would own land from here to there
In Locke era if you had connections with the nobles and kiss their asses you were give land and cheap labours to work such properties.
Mr. Dots have you tried Locke ideas with your local government?

duncan124: Not everyone buys or rents around here they just move into a deserted house and hope theres no one dead under ther floor.
Its not poor people its council workers and contractors, police and businessmen.Anyone who is part of the "in" crowd. When they have shat- up one house by not living right in it and taking it off the sewers so they don't have to pay they move on to another, and then another.

The Police are insane, they go miles to find a house lived in by a single woman who has died to climb into.
Then they go and arrest someone for "breaking in " to an empty house and get them fined, which they did to a friend of mine ,many years ago now. So now you have to be able to protect yourself and your new address.

salisburycin: Dots...thats not reality. Inthe US the gov't will take your property if it wants to. It doesn't matter if you own if out right or not. They will make you an offer and you are pretty much forced to take the offer. I live in Carolina and we have been raising H*LL about forced annexiation. That's just one small piece of land issues here. If they want to widen a road or create a new one...they will get that land even if you don't want to give it up. If a new business wants to build, they'll get that land, even if you don't want to give it up. You really have no say so in the matter and once annexation goes in effect additional taxes are forced upon you then you are paying the city tax, county tax, state tax, federal taxes, tax on food, tax on utilities, personal property and any other goods (including petro)that you buy, services, bla bla bla. We are suppose to pay taxes on our pets but they can kiss our a*s on that and the issue hasn't been pushed so...

http://www.carolinajournal.com/exclusives/display_exclusive.html?id=348

ohnonotthatguy: Miss Salisburycin Amero dollars is too Americana
Why not Mexy Siesta dollars or Canadian Beaver dollars

salisburycin: i dunno, thats just the name they came up with. It don't matter what the name is. How about sexy miesta dolla haha love the Canadian BEAVER dolla name too!!! I'd might more likely use it!

ohnonotthatguy: Mr Duncan,where you live?
Miss Salisburycin i feel very bad about the Americans burden with taxes and all the problems with Mexicans coming across the border and taking American jobs away
Here in Canada 48% of my income is taxed,what i buy I pay 13% and lets no talk about property taxes and dealing with the flush of Americans coming across my border and taking away Canadian jobs from my people

17% on that #%^^^*&^(*&(*&*$#@@$ up $5.50 a gallon of petro that is Canadian and that the Americans buy ir for a lot less

Sarcastic Dots: " Inthe US the gov't will take your property if it wants to."

I never said it was right, nor did I say it was the present reality. However, it is a form of idealism that existed during America's inception. Somewhere along the line America lost its way: through governmental interference, lobbyists and the foundations of american feudalism.

It's fine to blame the government for various issues, but that is only one part of the problem. The question asked was

" why should a house cost more than many people make in their lifetime? "

It costs more because people are greedy. People. Property is no longer awarded on the basis of work, but on the amount of wealth you inherited. America is sinking into a system that it sought to escape when it cut itself off from Europe. True, land is finite and it's not possible to offer everyone acres of land, but it's certainly possible to limit land to ones needs.

Why do people own more than one property?

Why are banks happy to evict those that can't pay their mortgage, leaving the house dormant for months, if not years?

Why don't banks re-evaluate mortgages in order to bring them in line with reality?

The answer to all those questions. Greed. It's not complicated, nor does it have anything to do with the government.


P.S. I'm fully aware that John Locke advocates a feudal system, but I don't agree with everything he says. Don't you worry about that.

duncan124: Well the thread was about the price of houses and people renting instead of buying.

What should happen when people die is the property is sold at auction by the Crown. With so many people dead that system collapsed, not least because the banks depended on rising house prices and with so many people dead they were forced to hire poorer quality staff who were offensive to poorer customers.

ohnonotthatguy: Banks don't fuel price of houses to rising its demand and supply that goes back to GREED and POWER

duncan124: "Banks don,t fuel price of houses.."? I think corrupt middlemen do corrupt the cost of housing.
"Supply and demand " there are more empty houses then people!

ohnonotthatguy: " there are more empty houses then people! "
Give your head a shake for a minute
Drive back to memory lane and see the housing market 15 years ago.
People flipping homes faster than they could piss and all the home renovation shows that came along with the experts on DIY projects than i could swing a broom at.
Look at how Billy Joe Public sold his stinking shed up the hill and run to Beverly Hills to live next door to his favorite actress or singer,where he could not even afford the !!!@#$$@! en taxes.
People fueled the house market with GREED and it will never recover in the USA
I have been building homes for the past 30 years and never seen a problem like in the USA
where a Mom,Dad,2 kids and the family pet .
Mom needs 3 rooms,dad can get by with just 2 rooms and the children will need 3 rooms each and cute little fluffy the flea ball will need 2 room plus the granny suit on week-ends.
Living beyond their means created the housing crises and the banks are collecting on their contracts with homeowners( mortgage loans)