Lord of the Sabbath (Page 2)

Cenababy
Cenababy: Chayi, give me the verses in the Bible that say to not drink blood....and ofcourse we don't drink peoples blood, that is not a law/commandment, it is human common sense....or show me the law Jesus did change things because he completed things. I know you are a Jew and will not see it this way and that's okay....but for Christians who follow Jesus, we will always believe differently.
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Cenababy
Cenababy: Zan another difference and so many more.....The law of Moses required many animal sacrifices, but because of the sacrificial death of Jesus, the sacrifices are no longer required. Moses wrote that sins could be atoned for through the performance of rituals, but this was a temporary and external atonement; Jesus simply forgave people as a permanent gift and a cleansed conscience. Jesus often told people to obey God, but Moses is not the standard by which obedience is now measured!

and again: Moses said one thing, but Jesus said another (Matthew 5:21-45). Jesus presented himself as the greater authority, the perfect authority, the basis on which people will be judged. Our lives should conform to the standard Jesus set, not the imperfect standard Moses wrote.

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Cenababy
Cenababy: as I stated and will always state, JESUS changed things and was the final authority over all. The old laws some still are followed, but the laws Jesus says to follow are the ones that all Christians must be called upon. If Jesus says there is no need for somethings since his return and sacrifice, then so be it. No other person has/had the right to tell us what to and what not to do but our Lord, if you are of a different religion so be it, but for a Christian to go against Jesus is blasphemy and the penalty is death!
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Zanjan
Zanjan: "because of the sacrificial death of Jesus, the sacrifices are no longer required. "

That's not why. Jesus said why animal sacrifices weren't required. Stephan sacrificed his life too, and a whole bunch of others did. It takes courage and a heart filled with the holy spirit to stand one's ground for truth. No one has a monopoly on that.

By the way, Jesus didn't forgive everybody. In fact, He told people they would perish if they didn't do what God wanted them to. The penalty for disobedience is spiritual distance, not death. When people don't trust God, they fall asleep. If one is spiritually dead, its because their denial of God's existence led them to that.

Jesus may have brought peace of mind to those who believe, but He sure didn't bring peace to the world - He said he didn't come for that. He brought a sword. He came to divide families and tear siblings and parents apart. Do you know why? I do.

If God had meant all the laws and teachings to remain the same, there wouldn't have been any need for another religion - that's what Chay believes in. Yet there was need for advancement so more Prophets and religions came, as they always have, and every one of these divine souls faced people who tried to kill them because they didn't like the message.

The Revelation God delivered to people in every age was strictly in accordance to their own capacity, not God's capacity.



(Edited by Zanjan)
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Cenababy
Cenababy: Stephan? lol, we is not JESUS.
the penalty is seperation yes, and death. It is written all over the bible.
sacrifices were a ritual to be close to God and be forgiven, that is no longer necessary because of Jesus and Jesus only.
Jesus won't forgive those who do not believe in him and love him and follow his ways, you are right, he did seperate the Godly from the ungodly, right again.
He gave peace to those who were suffering and afflicted because their belief in him and he knows our hearts.
There is NOT any reason for other religions. God said that and so does Jesus, we are to follow Jesus not prophets, period. We are not to put anyone above or before God.
The reason for other religions is so they can do it their way, man did that not God.
There will always be retribution against followers of Christ. and there will be death to those and seperation that do not follow Jesus, this is the Bible and the Christian belief.
"to their own capacity, not God's capacity" ????? you mean we will not always know the why's...and that not all is revealed, if so, that is correct....and people who can not hear and discern God's word that is because "they will not know God for that do not believe" they will not be able to discern the bible because it is not revealed to them!
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chay chayi
chay chayi: No, after Moses till Malachi was about 42 prophets, more than 1,000 years, and they did not change any law and not the religion, the opposite, they all warned in the name of God not to change any law, and they pointed out - NEVER, and some Jews killed them only for this reason, because they wanted to sin, and not to obey God's laws
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chay chayi
chay chayi: Cena, you did not answer my claim that you contradict yourself, i'll claim it again

You contradict yourself, you say that Jesus because he was sacrificed laws are not necessary, and Jesus said that you don't have to obey some laws of God, and he was still alive before he was sacrificed, and why some laws do remain, like not drinking blood etc. ???
(Edited by chay chayi)
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chay chayi
chay chayi: Leviticus
7:26 Moreover ye shall eat no manner of blood, whether it be of fowl or of beast, in any of your dwellings.

7:27 Whatsoever soul it be that eateth any manner of blood, even that soul shall be cut off from his people.

17:10 And whatsoever man there be of the house of Israel, or of the strangers that sojourn among you, that eateth any manner of blood; I will even set my face against that soul that eateth blood, and will cut him off from among his people.

17:11 For the life of the flesh is in the blood: and I have given it to you upon the altar to make an atonement for your souls: for it is the blood that maketh an atonement for the soul.

17:12 Therefore I said unto the children of Israel, No soul of you shall eat blood, neither shall any stranger that sojourneth among you eat blood.

17:13 And whatsoever man there be of the children of Israel, or of the strangers that sojourn among you, which hunteth and catcheth any beast or fowl that may be eaten; he shall even pour out the blood thereof, and cover it with dust.

17:14 For it is the life of all flesh; the blood of it is for the life thereof: therefore I said unto the children of Israel, Ye shall eat the blood of no manner of flesh: for the life of all flesh is the blood thereof: whosoever eateth it shall be cut off.
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Deuteronomy
12:16 Only ye shall not eat the blood; ye shall pour it upon the earth as water.

12:23 Only be sure that thou eat not the blood: for the blood is the life; and thou mayest not eat the life with the flesh.

12:24 Thou shalt not eat it; thou shalt pour it upon the earth as water.

12:25 Thou shalt not eat it; that it may go well with thee, and with thy children after thee, when thou shalt do that which is right in the sight of the LORD.

15:23 Only thou shalt not eat the blood thereof; thou shalt pour it upon the ground as water.
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This command is not only not to drink a cup of blood, and not only from human, but also that you should clean the meat from blood before you eat it

(And this command, like all 613 commands, besides 7, are only for the Jews)
(Edited by chay chayi)
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Cenababy
Cenababy: there's the point Chayii, the Christians do not follow the old Mosaic Laws, Jesus did set a presendence and he completed, Christians follow Jesus, Jews do not unless Messainic and know he is The Lord/Savior. When Jesus died he died to complete, and to be our sacrifice, We no longer have to follow a lot of the old laws because of his death such as,m rituals, sacrifices, eating only certain foods, etc. He changed all of that, for he was the sacrifice. Jesus was more concerened with "how we treat each other" and to love and live well. We are to cling to him and believe in him to have eternal salvation. This is the biggest difference between Christian and Jew. and thank you for the verses, yes, we do not eat blood either! LAWS, I never said "all" are not necessary, I am saying that Jesus changed some, they are obsolete - read in Hebrews, Jesus fulfilled and completed, Christians follow him and what he said.
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Cenababy
Cenababy: Chayii, and to us, Jesus is LORD not a mere man or Prophet, no Prophet did what all Jesus did or could do, they could not die and give us eternal salvation, never! He is the only one we can go through to go to Heaven. He is the only one who can give all humanity salvation, he is the Messiah, and HE will return to take us home
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chay chayi
chay chayi: Cena, you keep repeating your words, and you don't answer the clear claims against what you say, and you are contradictional with everything you say
(Edited by chay chayi)
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chay chayi
chay chayi: And your basic thing is --- leave God and his commands, only love your body, flesh and blood, don't think of God, only of humanity - flesh blood orgasm love

You wipe out God and every connection of him, and you worship humanity

This is Satan
(Edited by chay chayi)
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Cenababy
Cenababy: what? how do you say that or think that? I never said that!
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chay chayi
chay chayi: You don't answer and respond any clear claims you are asked, you only repeat the same words
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chay chayi
chay chayi: God said in the Torah, that you should not eat unclean creators, came Jesus against the Torah and said;

Mark
18 And he said to them, Are you still so slow of wit? Do you not observe that all the uncleanness which goes into a man has no means of defiling him, 19 because it travels, not into his heart, but into the belly, and so finds its way into the sewer? Thus he declared all meat to be clean

He declared against what God said to Moses NOT TO EAT UNCLEAN CREATORS, he said, "you may eat them", because "they are clean"

And the reason what he said is lies and not true, all the food you eat, the best part of it returns part of the entire body

And all this he said to his people that ate unclean food, when he was alive, before he was crucified

And so on, more laws he broke what God told Moses in the Torah, and it was while he was alive
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Emmet2Tim2_7
Emmet2Tim2_7: Ro 2:12 For as many as have sinned without law shall also perish without law: and as many as have sinned in the law shall be judged by the law;
Ro 2:13 (For not the hearers of the law [are] just before God, but the doers of the law shall be justified.
We see here that the law is still in effect,not done away with.
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chronology
chronology: cenababy. Eating Blood is still banned for Christians, it is banned with some other foods, read Acts 15. Personally I enjoy Shellfish which is banned in the Old Testament, I eat Shellfish every week because God told Peter such foods are now permissible for believers in Christ. Jewish folks cannot eat Shellfish because they must obey the Old Testament Law.

Chayiii is right about eating Blood damning people, Jewish or none Jewish, it is a sin on the same level as sodomy and murder. Never heard of 'Blood Pudding' they sell them in every American and European City. If you call your self a Christian and eat that food you committing a serious sin. In some countries they mix snake blood with saki wine, this is just as damnable as eating blood puddings.
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Cenababy
Cenababy: Chron, yes, I know.I don't eat blood, and yes, the foods are clean. I know Jews still have to go by old laws (as they do not think Jesus was who he was), to them, a mere prophet! go figure
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Cenababy
Cenababy: Chayi, I do not follow Satan, and I never said the things you think I do. Jesus was of higher authority than Moses, that is clear. You are a Jew you will never understand or agree with others. You are entitled to your opinions just as we are.
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Emmet2Tim2_7
Emmet2Tim2_7: De 18:18 I will raise them up a Prophet from among their brethren, like unto thee, and will put my words in his mouth; and he shall speak unto them all that I shall command him.

Is this Jesus or not ,Cena?
1.) says Prophet
2.)'like unto thee' ...like Moses
Cant be greater if he is like Moses
3.)Jesus was COMMANDED to speak...does god really take commands?
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Cenababy
Cenababy: like unto thee - an israelite, their countrymen!
I never said Jesus was not a Prophet, I said he was more than that...and if we look at "who" he is, is he not a greater authority than Moses?

A New Prophet
…17"The LORD said to me, 'They have spoken well. 18'I will raise up a prophet from among their countrymen like you, and I will put My words in his mouth, and he shall speak to them all that I command him. 19It shall come about that whoever will not listen to My words which he shall speak in My name, I Myself will require it of him.…

I will raise up for them a prophet like you from among their fellow Israelites, and I will put my words in his mouth. He will tell them everything I command him.

1. 18:15-22 It is here promised concerning Christ, that there should come a Prophet, great above all the prophets; by whom God would ...

A New Prophet
…16"This is according to all that you asked of the LORD your God in Horeb on the day of the assembly, saying, 'Let me not hear again the voice of the LORD my God, let me not see this great fire anymore, or I will die.' 17"The LORD said to me, 'They have spoken well. 18'I will raise up a prophet from among their countrymen like you, and I will put My words in his mouth, and he shall speak to them all that I command him.…


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Cenababy
Cenababy: PS Emmet, you know that we shall never agree that Jesus did speak for "the father" and you know that Christians believe him to be "as one", so what I was trying to tell Chayii is that we read the Bible differently and he does not believe in the NT, and Christians do, the whole point of why I said, you are a Jew. ALSO, Emmet, is he just like Moses? Really? or would Jesus be the greater authority? Isn't he "the Messiah", I think it holds water that I was correct in saying "he is the greater authority"
(Edited by Cenababy)
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Emmet2Tim2_7
Emmet2Tim2_7: does the bible SAY that he is the greater authority? We like do think so but u and I know the warnings against adding to the word.
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Cenababy
Cenababy: well, we shall see....I talked to several tonight, they said the same thing.... I shall check it out. and yes, geesshhh I know better...so let me correct myself if I am wrong...
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chay chayi
chay chayi: The whole Messiah thing, and that he has God's spirit, and he's more than Moses, is all the Jewish wisdom, the first Christians and Jesus included were Jews - Israelites, they were students of Rabbis

The only wrong thing about Jesus is, that being the Messiah, and having God's spirit, and being more than Moses, and breaking God's laws and words are contradictional
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