The True Truth (Page 3)

dadman1240
dadman1240: well the dude has nothing to do with Christian eschatology ..... but he does sound like a wonderful candidate for antichrist (one world governance / one world religion) ..... I'll put him on the list of those I watch ..... http://dadmansabode.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p=1697#p1697 ... later
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ghostgeek
ghostgeek: How come you religious people all think you're right in what you believe yet can never agree on what it is you should believe?
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Zanjan
Zanjan: We religious people agree on tons of things since we have more in common with each other than anyone else.

Tell me, what do non-religious people believe? Would these be the ones who are right?
(Edited by Zanjan)
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ghostgeek
ghostgeek: I turned on the news today and guess what I heard. Another report of the religious killing the religious. How often do you hear of atheists killing atheists? Not very often.
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Zanjan
Zanjan: The Cops - sometimes, the person they kill doesn't even have to be armed.

Abortionists are a bunch of Godless killers - the tally is obviously high but they aren't counting. I say Godless because they murder the helpless innocent.

Drug Crime Syndicates - particularly those in Columbia and Central America.

Revenge hit men - perps of school shootings & gangland slayings.

Prison Inmates & serial killers on the loose

Thugs & Domestic abusers

Foreign Spies & CIA agents

Together, that's all I seem to hear about.

(Edited by Zanjan)
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ghostgeek
ghostgeek: Zanjan, the people you mention may be out and out killers but that doesn't mean they're atheists. One's profession doesn't mark you out as a non believer.
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Zanjan
Zanjan: It's true that some cops are God-believers but they don't kill for religion - the good ones try to maim instead of kill.

In N. America, I figure there's as many dirty cops as snake lawyers and politicians. That's why the public wants them to start wearing cams.

There are no God-believers in the rest of my list.
(Edited by Zanjan)
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ghostgeek
ghostgeek: I contend that you are wrong Zanjan. As evidence I submit the names of three serial killers who had religious leanings:

Bruce Lee murdered 26 people. Bible reading was his only consolation.

David Berkowitz, called the SON OF SAM, murdered more than 10 women. He called himself a born again Christian.

The Yorkshire Ripper was on a divine mission and felt he had been chosen to hear the word of God.

Criminals, spies, thugs and all manner of obnoxious people can be devout, even priests it seems.
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Zanjan
Zanjan: Bruce Lee didn't murder anyone. He was a Martial Arts instructor, actor and film maker.

Berkowitz and the Ripper were evil, psychotic liars. When caught, they invented crazy stories so they could plead insanity - a common tactic used to avoid regular prison or death penalty. Both were discredited.

Every country has their share of serial killers from time to time - they're all the same.

Many priests don't believe in God - these are infiltrators, using religion as a cover for nefarious activities. Like the above, they'll always be found out.

Naturally, more thieves escape than are caught.



(Edited by Zanjan)
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ghostgeek
ghostgeek: Not Bruce Lee the actor Zanjan, Bruce George Peter Lee (born Peter Dinsdale 31 July 1960) one of Britain’s most prolific killers. He confessed to a total of 11 acts of arson, and was convicted of 26 counts of manslaughter. 11 of these were overturned on appeal. Lee was imprisoned for life in 1981. Being a nutter doesn't mean you can't be close to God, even if it's only in your head.
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Zanjan
Zanjan: Betrkowitz was an arsonist too, didn't you know? Told ya they're all the same. Only the weak-minded gullible would believe their lies.

You seem to be confusing Satan with God.

If you're close to God, you aren't nuts.

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ghostgeek
ghostgeek: If somebody claims to believe in God all you can do is accept their word, even if to all appearances they act like a raving nutter. My newspaper in the morning is currently full of reports of wild eyed fanatics rampaging through the Middle East in the name of God, but has no comparable tales of demented atheists charging about under the banner of reason. This leads me to the unsophisticated opinion that those who claim to be close to God aren't to be trusted.
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Zanjan
Zanjan: No, I don't have to accept their word for it, Ghost - the majority of people today are liars and fakers; their words mean nothing.

Atheists think of themselves first, not the condition of society, now or in the future. THAT'S unreasonable for the inherent design of a human.

Atheists bark a lot, pretending to care while professing to know what's right, yet do nothing for the innocent and downtrodden. It's not in them to be fair or just. As long as they stay at home and sit on the couch, that's fine by me; it's the hypocrite atheists that get in the way and have to be firmly dealt with.

The hypocrites haven't lost their spiritual inheritance - God took it from them.

(Edited by Zanjan)
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Zanjan
Zanjan: Don't get me wrong, I have nothing against atheists - I'm certain they'll eventually learn. I honour everyone's right to move as slowly as they wish; also, I respect God's justice.

What I'm against is deliberate falsehoods/misrepresentations of sacred scriptures and lies about other people, living or passed on. I aim to correct inaccuracies.
(Edited by Zanjan)
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ghostgeek
ghostgeek: Let me run something past you Zanjan, just for a laugh. Believers bark a lot, pretending to care while professing to know what's right, yet do nothing for the innocent and downtrodden. It's not in them to be fair or just. Such a statement, I'm sure you'll agree, would be doing a grave injustice to a lot of decent people. The fact is though, to make a similar statement about atheists is to be just as guilty of bigoted thinking. It's easy to make sweeping generalisations, based upon some attribute that people may share, but it is hardly just. Sorry but I was feeling a little prickly.

Where I can agree with you is in being against deliberate falsehoods or misrepresentations, of any kind.
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Zanjan
Zanjan: ". Such a statement, I'm sure you'll agree, would be doing a grave injustice to a lot of decent people"

No, I don't agree. Once again, your certainty turfed out - I recommend you don't go into business as a private detective, ok. Real believers don't follow the same MO as unbelievers.

I state the truth. I've never seen any atheist claim they never lie or deceive; generally, they know they don't have grounds and are honest enough with themselves that they know they'd fail when investigated or tested. They dare not tempt fate.

Hypocrite unbelievers, be they religious or not, *pretend* they don't lie or deceive; they're too vain to realize they'll always be caught, and quickly. They're the predators.

As for justice and fairness, we all have our own idea of that but there's only two perspectives available - the one coming from the truly wronged one, and the one coming from the wrongdoer.

If this judgement is in a civil court of law, justice is determined by the one who has the most money, and this is wrong.

(Edited by Zanjan)
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ghostgeek
ghostgeek: Zanjan, may I suggest you take a little time to think about what you're saying. What you've just said above is that believers bark a lot, pretending to care while professing to know what's right, yet do nothing for the innocent and downtrodden. It's not in them to be fair or just. That surely isn't your considered opinion, is it?
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Zanjan
Zanjan: I specifically addressed your own sentence - not mine. I'd also thought about what you were saying and chose to overlook your wrong, but then you tempted fate.

You're an atheist, right?

You copied my writing word for word, then replaced a single word with your own - that's plagiarism. Do try to be more creative with a focus on legal. I rest my case.
(Edited by Zanjan)
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ghostgeek
ghostgeek: I don't know what I am Zanjan, I only know what I'm not. I'm not a believer in any of the religions of Man. Just because you follow the teachings of one such religion doesn't give you the right to denigrate those who see no merit in such beliefs. To say, as you do, that atheists think of themselves first, not the condition of society, displays breathtaking arrogance. You do not know this, it is just an assumption on your part, yet you prattle on about how belief in God elevates you above those with honest doubts. It is a conceit to think belief in a deity makes you a better person than someone who doesn't profess such faith. It doesn't. Sanctimonious self-righteousness won't get you to Heaven, if such a place exists.
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dadman1240
dadman1240: God does not exist ?? .... "it is just an assumption on your part" ... lol
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Zanjan
Zanjan: Ghost, I don't denigrate those who have different beliefs than mine. However, those who have different values than mine have spoken for themselves, as you did. Like seeks like.

If you'd thought what you did was a good thing, you wouldn't have blamed me for it. To call others arrogant and conceited when you can't defend your claims or actions is just a parthinian shot. You realize those always miss the mark.

If you don't know what you are, you're not a God-centered person.

If people aren't God centered, what else is their centeredness?

Eventually, you may realize that the accuser is the one who's guilty of the accusation - every time. Put that one on your watch list and see for yourself.

(Edited by Zanjan)
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ghostgeek
ghostgeek: What are you talking about Dadman. Who's stating that God doesn't exist? My contention is that all the religions on this earth, past and present, were conceived by human beings and therefore have nothing relevant to say on the question of God. God may or may not exist, as Gerald likes to say, something the world's religious texts cannot help us answer. Faith is meaningless in this context because it presupposes the existence of something that has not been established, the existence of God. Show me God and I will acknowledge His existence.
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ghostgeek
ghostgeek: Zanjan, I object, and object strongly, to a moral judgement being made about a person based solely on a label that's assigned them by someone else. To judge a person's character on what beliefs they do or do not hold, without reference to their actions, is, in my book, a simple case of prejudice. I cannot speak for Canada but over here in the UK we have laws against that sort of thing. Now I know your position very well, you believe in God, and I have stated my position in my post to Dadman, so only one question remains. Do we continue with this spat, to no one's benefit, or shall we move on?
(Edited by ghostgeek)
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Zanjan
Zanjan: Ghost, objection is your habit in these forums. This one, too, gets drowned amongst your many denials of the obvious. Actions speak louder than words, actions you can't defend.

I will say you do tend to ask good questions; however, your answers to the same don't bear the identical quality. I reckon that's because you didn't actually know the answers yourself.

Only two questions remain:

Who invented your morals? Who are you to question God and wrangle with Kings?

(Edited by Zanjan)
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ghostgeek
ghostgeek: Zanjan, somebody has to raise the odd objection once in a while, just to keep everybody on their toes. And your right, I'm not chock-a-block full of answers, but neither is anyone else either. Now, as to who invented my morals, well I guess they came from living in the world. Which leaves us with why I question God and wrangle with Kings. As it happens, I've been thinking about this God chap. I'm a wondering why He doesn't put in an appearance once in a while to give the unbelievers like me a fright. He used to hobnob with us humans, at least according to the Bible, but not any more. Why is that, would you say? I hope you'll forgive me answering my own question in my own inimitable way but could it be the old critter doesn't actually exist? Well, I'm sure you won't agree to that but, you see, poor me, I have these doubts. Just because some old book says there's some buffer above the sky I need a little more... err, proof. Otherwise I'm likely to continue thinking the old chap's a figment of some scribe's imagination. Phew, I'm glad that's out the way so that I can get on to the really important issue. Why would you think I'd be wrangling with Kings?
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