An open letter to Liberals. (Page 2) OCD_OCD: I know a guy who is trying to start up his own company. He has a masters degree and is stocking groceries at night so that he will have insurance benefits. He works during the day on his start-up. Minimum wage, as far as I can tell, is a place to start, not a place to stay.  MichaeI: I've said somewhere else before that job doesn't define who someone is as a human being. A person who picks up garbage on the side of the road is no better then the CEO of Wal-Mart. Okay, bad example. Succinct Verbosity: It is a place to start, but my point is, who WORKS harder. Paris Hilton or a burger flipping minimum wage worker? And, Michael, you sure seem to be back-peddling, because one post ago you were happy to insinuate that those who earn less are worth less. MichaeI: So are you defining "works harder" as manual labor? Most Ceo's put in extensively long hours as to most people who work for minimum wage get a 40 hour week or less. My post that I said about Ceo's not out digging ditches isn't an implication that they are better than anyone. I was pointing out that you are comparing apples to oranges as far as "manual labor" to the other. Robot Seb: Education is a big aspect as well. A lot of the people that run businesses know a lot more than whats required.  MichaeI: Just to clarify, my first job was working at a Dairy Queen when I was a teenager. I didn't feel like anyone was better than me. People just have different roads that they are on. I've also done manual labor from building houses, working on automobiles to being an assistant manager in a Fortune 500 company. I don't feel as though my self-worth changed as I went from job to job. It was just building blocks. Succinct Verbosity: I'm using a very specific example, here. Not CEO's... Paris Hilton. My point being that rich people are not uniformly in that position due to hard work. The issue I take is that the market isn't working the way conservatives have envisioned. Social mobility has collapsed. Those in poverty and work hard are not climbing the ladder,, and those that either failed or have inherited their wealth never fall down it. ENRON is the perfect example of the fragility of the stock market, where you can effectively sell nothing, hoard wealth and put thousands of people out of a job. I suspect if we were having this conversation about ENRON 15 years ago we would -and many did- paint their CEO's as contributors to society, and we all know how that turned out. (Edited by Succinct Verbosity) Robot Seb: my first job was a bowling alley lol I got to handle the beer when the bar needed it but wasn't allowed to drink it.... laws where different back then lol MichaeI: Paris Hilton is a CEO of her companies though. I was saying that she is classified as a CEO so that means that she does work hard. She just probably doesn't get her nails dirty. The latter part of the stuff you mentioned I can't argue with because it's true what you said. Robot Seb: @succint there's an asian saying that's like "hey it's the luck of the draw" lol we don't get to choose who we are in life but we have to make the best of it. OCD_OCD: Paris Hilton and Kim Kardashian think they work harder. And to them, that is more important than "reality". Do I think Paris and Kim deserve all of their money? Yeah. Why not? If they can get stupid people to pay them to act like twits, then it works for them. It's the stupid people who apparently enjoy it and feel like it's worth their time to watch. Mental labor is harder on the mind, manual labor is harder on the bod. I guess it depends on what you are better suited for and have the education and ability to do that decides what you do and how you do it. Nothing wrong with doing manual labor, but then again, there's nothing wrong with using your brain, either. OCD_OCD: I think my point is WHO gets to decide whether someone has earned their money? As far as I'm concerned, as long as it is done legally....no one. The fact that I have a better idea that makes more money than someone else doesn't mean that I'm beating puppies and taking food from the mouths of babies. There is always a choice in life. To me, the main choice is do you get an education? Education is available, but do you take it seriously and work at it or do you simply skate through without learning anything or maybe quit and then become indignant because you can't get what you want? Some people inherit their wealth, but the majority of people earn it through ingenuity, hard work and a lot of personal sacrifice. People who get something for nothing do none of those things. Robot Seb: ^  lol people that have less do appreciate everything that much more. All I had was a bike and a nintendo I never played when I was younger.... there was no internet yet. OCD_OCD: Do people that have less appreciate something more because they got it or because they earned it? Robot Seb: definitely more appreciated when it's earned although when something has sentimental value, being given it would be just as special if not more lol MichaeI: I feel an over-whelming sense of entitlement. I took the garbage out today and should be rewarded for that. OCD_OCD: The reward might be that she doesn't dump it on your side of the bed and then go sleep in the spare bedroom. Ha-ha-ha-ha! Just so you know....women can be devious. Succinct Verbosity: There is always a choice in life. To me, the main choice is do you get an education? Education is available, but do you take it seriously and work at it or do you simply skate through without learning anything or maybe quit and then become indignant because you can't get what you want? Higher Education costs money. A lot of money.  LiptonCambell: lol its not as if we live in a theocracy where you have to be part of the noble elite to afford education. People who work hard can get aid. People who work harder still get scholarships . Whats the alternative you're suggesting? That everyone gets to become doctors on the tax payers dime? | Politics Chat Room 84 People Chatting Similar Conversations |
